Also. I think many secular leftists have a repurposed version of Christian belief that has its own Good v Evil, Saints, commandments, sins, etc.

The left is literally evil. Notch gets it

They already speak in a zealous manner, just with their own secular political beliefs.

@⚡Clark⚡ the left and right dichotomy is the easy to read version of the actual political battle for normies. I really do see it as evil vs good, with varying levels in between

@⚡Clark⚡ makes a good point

And that is mainly my point

Not that I’m spiritual

Mainly atheist/agnostic but I used to be mormon and realize my zeal was never higher than when I thought myself to be completely chosen by god

So that is my point. But there are definitely flaws in such a worldview I’m sure

I’m just kind of rambling but wanted to hear all your thoughts. I guess my main point is how does a secular ideology compete with religious like zeal? Cause in aspect I think generally they lose, but I don’t know much concerning history besides the Mormons definitely did concede to the US out west

Obviously a big secular group has tamed many religious groups

Sadly some people out there aren't able to discern between religiosity and spirituality. It's getting better though

The secular and even often anti-religiousity of the asian communist movements were quite zealous..

Definitely true. Do you think it’s cause communism is like crazy idealism? Aiming for this Utopia/pie in the sky/ heaven on earth?

So essentially heaven in a lot of ways

It’s probably difficult to delineate ideological/religious Utopianism, for the purposes of the strength of conviction

Heaven on earth = 100,000,000 deaths

It’s very important to distinguish “a desire for improvement” from “a desire for perfection.” The latter leads to some dark places when perfection never comes.

Especially when you try to establish heaven on earth top-bottom style ya

I'm chanting "WE WANT WALLS!"

I’m dying and going to heaven type belief is harmless ahah

@ophiuchus Also consider the desire for individual improvement versus societal improvement makes a difference.

Is saying "congratulations" an appropriate answer when you find out an acquaintance is jewish?

I didn't know what else to say

Haha

I’m always like “that’s cool”

In hindsight that probably would've been better.
I was nice about it and she smiled and said thanks, but couldn't hide those "is he patronizing me?" eyes

I just say "Oh wow, that's awesome!"

"weird flex, but okay"

I think the, "Utopia" as an ideal that happens almost immediately is false, and is used more as a lie to promote a evil ideology. One of them being Communism. I don't think an actual, morally sound Utopia would call itself a, "Utopia." Why convince yourself and others of what is already possible? You only have to convince others you're something that you're not, if you have something to hide.

I usually don’t say anything because we’ve generally long been knew by the point they tell you.

@Goose I'd say..."shalom"

Also, I hope you Identitarians have gone to the gym and read some books!

Never stop self improving 💪

https://www.npr.org/2018/12/08/580136829/chief-of-staff-john-kelly-to-leave-at-the-end-of-the-year

@The Eternal Anglo what are you reading these days?

@Myndrian I personally don't find religion very motivating

It seems too abstract to me. If my politics and religion conflict, the politics would win out just because they're more tangible.

still more real than the Woke 8-Year-Old Iranian Girl

LMAO that's a parody of the Syrian girl, right?

Any thoughts on the concept of free will vs. determinism in regards to a higher power or lack of? I don’t understand how free will can exist without a higher power but maybe my perception of scientific explanation is limited.