Romania has an even stronger correlation, but I admit to not knowing much about their politics

Almost anyone >>> ottomans

Soviet Union > EU

EEC was fine, but it was always intended to become a United States of Europe

I'm memeing but I'm also serious

Kalergi and others were clear on that

bad economic politices or whatever can be fixed

demographics displacement is hard to fix

Ehh. I think it's best to just say both the EU and USSR are horrible. We suggest, dare I say, a *third position* between communism and neoliberal globalism

I mean if I had to chose I'd pick the USSR

They at least had border controls

@Alex Kolchak - NY I guess they never miss, huh.

I'd choose the EU/USA because we can do more to turn things around here

@Zilna Jestov oof...

Not to mention I enjoy food

it’s all relative

I honestly doubt communism was as bad as immigrants say it is

I mean ya sure it was bad

but immigrants will always find stuff to whine about

my grandmother and mother just kind of took it for what it was

Anarchists are technically correct that the USSR was not real communism

And that's the space in which the USSR can be praised

my grandma appreciated having a consistent job and living in the decades after WWII when her village was literally razed

Yeah and then Lenin btfod the black army

Bye byeee

but I’m in no way defending the structural failings of communism

just that most ordinary people went along with it because it was decent enough most of the time

Well, the claims are pretty silly if you think about them for a bit. If I'm to believe what immigrants say, they had to wait 4 hours to get bread and everyone was starving. You'd think I'd have family members with stunted growth due to malnourishment if that was actually true.

My family wasn't particularly well off

fun fact: my (American) dad was in Moscow when the first McDonald’s opened there

*that’s when it all went downhill*

My dad got into a Billy Joel concert in Leningrad for free cause he told the guard he was American and Billy Joel was his countryman

@Nemets Do you have a source on the stunted growth?

Breadlines are likely a real memory but not a daily occurrence. America had gas lines in the 70s. Same idea. The holodomor is undeniable though

oh lol

@TMatthews I mean ya I'm sure Stalin did some bad stuff but I doubt that 70s Eastern block was as bad as they hype it up to be

Life expectancy in Russia was and is atrocious, but that goes beyond just economics

Stalin died in 1953

Let's just say that, as bad as the west is today, we still have nothing remotely near what the Eastern bloc had in terms of thought police. Most of us would be dead or in gulags by now if we did