well they're a boogieman due to the media propping them up as such

The democratic party knows that they think as collectives. For civic nationalism to work you need to stop them thinking as a ethinc or racial group to work. How will you do it?

that's why people like Sargon, Milo, and Jordan peterson have to be 'Alt-Right Mouthpieces'

But Aussie, you're in a collective as well.

by taking away their welfare
force them to actually bother doing something themselves

The easiest way to get someone to stop thinking collectively is to treat & judge them like an individual

I know Rye. My point is that civic nationalism gose against Human nature so it can't work.

so does communism, or any other form of group ideology

We have laws/policies that are meant to help “the X community”. Stop doing that. Make laws and policies that help everyone. By only helping “the X community” you’re enforcing the idea that everyone in that group is similar

^ ^ ^

My big concern with civic nationalism, which I prefer in theory, is that so far it hasn't addressed the assimilation question: what about those that refuse to assimilate? It only works if everyone is on-board with it, but what if they are not? I know there's the easy "don't let those people in" response, but the problem is we already have.

When in reality their individuals with individual needs

I don't know where this Deller guy came from

but I like'em

Narnia

Yes communism dosen't and that is why t dosen't work. Group Idenity is natural you need to make people atomized individuals to not think in those terms.

group identity is not natural

People turn on each other the moment its more profitable

Group identity only works when people believe theres profit as an individual in it

Yes what is history but nationals fighting each other.

they're fought for profit, resources, more control by eliminating other faiths that tell you otherwise

Yes civilization is people giving up some of their right for their benifits.

I mean even apes organize as a tribe and fight each other for resources.

yes, because its strength in numbers

if they had true group identity, the alpha of the pack wouldn't constantly shift whilst they're in their prime

That wasn't real tribalism.

lel

Today we’re allies against a common enemy, tomorrow we’re enemies because being friends is no longer in my best interests

So why shouldn't we do it in the most natural way by doing with people who are genetically similar?

#Stalin&Roosevelt

we are doing the most natural thing

How?

You think the French and the Norse are genetically similar, m8?

In terms of race yes.

being an individual is more profitable for succesful people because our society is moddled so

Being poor and demanding free stuff is profitable if the alternative is having the exact same and working all day

Becase they are the same race.

What makes you think non whites will let that happen?

it is happening right now

Non whites want handouts not no handouts.

Lazy people want handouts

Lazy people come in many colors

if they could make more money off of it, they wouldn't want handouts

but they don't because most people who want handouts are lazy and too stupid to get "better income"

Again we are not talking about outlires, we are talking about averages.

On average a Black Nigerian American works harder than a white American

Not every black person is like Thomas Sowell.

the issue in the west right now is that "welfare" nets you almost as much income as minimum wage

so why would you even bother then?

And for that reason, you would deport Thomas Sowell?

@Deller that's becase you get the talented 10th.

Should we just put Nigerian & Asian Americans in charge of our country because they work the hardest?

@RyeNorth Africans need his high IQ genes more then we do.

See, what you're talking about here

THAT'S actually what goes against ACTUAL nature.

forget human nature, the natural world has always been a meritocracy.

No beacuse America is a nation for Americans no asian, blacks, ect.

Of groups yes. The best tribe wins.

and merit is specifically attributed to the individual.

no, of individuals, the best one wins

And a society built of the best individuals

One individual can't beat 100 weak people who work as a group.

will trump a society built on race every time.

So why give European Americans a pass, but not African or Asian Americans? By your logic shouldn’t we give America back to the Native Americans and all of us White, Black, & Asian Americans gtfo?

guy just take this one,

If we go by your idea of "the best tribe wins" then black people are the best tribe
because in the west right now, its certainly not the white people and not the asians that are winning, implying that black people are the best

Not the white race.

It depends on your metric if you're gauging demographics.

Why are you treating white people as a collective? There’s a pretty large cultural difference between my Irish heritage & by buddy’s Greek Heritage

@Deller You won the land from them and built a nation on it so it's yours they have some land for them to live on but the rest is yours.

If you're judging merit on physical prowess

I think once whites start thinking as a group again we will win easily.

Then the best one for the job may well be a melanin-rich individual.

@RyeNorth I'm talking in general, White people have to work hard as a result pay most taxes etc, and get punished for being racist for being against it

Black people in America (and arabs in Europe) get money, housing, welfare and affirmative action

I thought you wanted to end the collective group think

Oh, yeah, right, I get that.

And focus on individuals

Yes the problem is your thinking in terms of individuals when others think as a collective.

No, he thinks that we should do what our opposition does because our opposition needs to be stopped because of what they're doing.

Why the fuck would I want to think as a collective

It's circular reasoning at it's most insane.

but then you get a paradox

If white people adopt the logic that black people follow (in your mind)
Then white people would win by using a black people tactic

Meaning the black people had it right all along

I think we need to stop the left being anti white.

yes

I absolutely agree with that, aussie.

Yes, being anti-(insert ethnic group) is bad

no one is arguing that we should stop punishing white people for the crime of being white

Correct that, Jayred

But why does wanting to stop anti white rhetoric mean I should adopt collective thinking

but the solution to stopping people from being punished for being white

Is NOT to punish black people for being black

An individual can't beat a collective.

tell that to that florida shooter

too soon

it was him against dozens

Uh, that was something else entirely... lol

It irritates the fuck out of me when people go “you white people.....” why would I want to adopt that same ignorant outlook

You assume that an individual can't form coalitions as well.

The difference between an Individualist and a Collectivist

Becase you are of that group so bying saying that people shouldn't say bad things about your group means you are thinking as a collectivist.

is that when the groups an Individualist subscribes to stray from the individual's path

they unsubscribe

@JadenFrostwolf ofc, but when you compare statistics, it was 1 individual white guy mowing down a lot of others

For instance

I'm with you on several points

I think the Anti-white rhetoric has to stop

I'm just saying Florida shouldn't apply because the entire thing was a mess, on several levels.