https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jy6AOGRsR80

this or our current national anthem

@Unwound How many want war in Syria at the moment?

66'

No one wants war. But now that we created this mess, a vacuum looks even worse than some variation on the current measured course.

We should never have invaded Iraq in 2003.

But we did.

That is not true.
There are some people that want war.

John McCain was one of them.

Ben Shapiro is another one of those

Good point. The reason we're in this mess is because a bipartisan, multinational coalition wanted it in 2003. :-/

Let me rephrase what I meant to say. No one *here* that has made their opinions known wants war.

I feel a mixture of things on this, but ultimately I lean towards no. Errantry wars in the rest of the world DO keep the military sharp... but if nothing else, we have to much to handle at home ATM.

War is bad, it gets people killed, costs astronomical sums of money, and usually makes things far worse before they get better, but it should always be on the table and should only be used when all other diplomatic options have been exhausted

Yes, exactly

Might be happening in France soon

I don't *want* war. I merely recognize it as an incredibly powerful tool of conflict resolution.

indeed

Nobody said you'd want it.

Its just that there are some people who are pro War

and Ben Shapiro looks like one of those people

War....war never changes...

WRONG

we used to fight with sticks and stones

then swords and arrows

then guns and missiles

Now we use Memes

you could describe war as a constant, the medium has simply changed

and IDK. I haven't seen Shapiro's statements on war.

In any case though, I do feel that a lot of the existing insanity in the current generation might have been mitigated if the young people of america saw life outside of america itself

for some reason, I'm picturing some hillarious american analog to the french foreign legion

soudns like a monty python skit

I just want to say this about the Tlaib video. How many Israelis have dual citizenship? Many have both American and Israeli citizenship. Citizenship means that you are supposed to be loyal to the country that you are a citizen of. What happens when these two states have diverging interests? You can't be equally loyal to two masters. It is not anti-semitic to ask the obvious question of whether someone who may have dual citizenship will be loyal to the US, or a to foreign power. It is also not anti-semitic to ask if someone who is a Zionist is loyal to the US or to Israel. After all, Zionism is Israeli nationalism. It would be reasonable to ask this if someone is a Turkish nationalist, or a Russian nationalist, or a Chinese nationalist. You can't be equally loyal to two different countries. But we can't ask this of Israeli nationalists in our government and legislative bodies? Why not?

You can be equally loyal to two masters...so long as you must never choose between them.

I was was watching Tim’s video about the fall of Rome compared to the US

And something that occurred to me is that, the culture war doesn’t need to become mainstream for it to be a civil war

All it needs is 5% of the population to be radicalized, mobilized, and armed to fight a civil war

You get 5 percent of the US population to be radicalized, split it in half for two sides

Those are two armies of over 8 million people, able to to fight each other over control

And historically that’s how it’s been; a political minority with the will to fight defeating the civilian government and enforcing their will

@Vannevariable Ben thinks war is justified as long as it is helping america's (((ally))) in the middle east.

I don’t think it will come to that

Even the poor have a lot to lose due to capitalism

“I would love to join your civil war but I have a smash tournament later also I just like to complain I don’t want to actually do anything about it”

How long can the "Walls don't work" ruse be kept up by the left?

seriously speaking.

Until the wall is built and it's proved to be wrong.

No. When the wall is built they can go from the wall doesnt work to the narrative "the wall wasnt actually trumps idea. It was us the Democrats for years!"

It will be kept up until they die as a political wing

the american left has built themselves on resistance and countering trump

I can't wait to see how they handle in 2024

because one way or another trump is probably out of office by then

All employed illegal immigrants are commiting a crime when they work. Is this true?

CAPTAIN OBVIOUS CALLING!

you need a work permit to work in foreign countrys.

It is something that seems to be ignored/forgotten every time someone says only a small percentage of illegal immigrants commit crimes.

Well everyone in a country without legal permission is committing a crime period. Its called tresspassing

Are either of these criminal chargable offences?

Yep.

NH State law, You can be arrested, put in jail and brought before a judge for Trespassing, The Judge can fine you and order your removal from the property permanently. Everystate has their own version

There is only natural law.

tell that to the fed lol

Is a declining population bad news?

Declining population in high average IQ countries, yes.
Declining population in low average IQ countries not really, just higher standard of living for them, I can't see any serious negative consequences.

It is because of the Pyramid Scheme aka "Pensions"....

declining population is a natural correction

if you have like 3 times the number of Pensioners than working population, you're fucked.

and we don't have a capital based system

indeed, that is a problem.

well, slightly.

"natural" is rather weird word for a government program

government programs are not the cause of declining population. well, not directly.

Not directly, but they certainly are

Thing is: I'd NOT do anything and think about the children.

we had a very large boom in people after a sharp reduction basically all across the west.

or give the MALES free higher education but not the FEMALES

things need to come back down from the overshoot

and allow discrimination in pay because of Gender, if they don't have children

now, this affecting the economy IS a problem caused by the government

without government fucking with shit, wages would rise as labor supplies fall

Yes but importing low IQ people from Africa isn't the solution.

or religios fanatics from the middle east

but the government comes in with their pension system and mess with it.

if the government does nothing and lets the pension system go unfunded and stop paying shit out, the system will correct itself.

Exactly

trust in Nature, bitches

if the government does not do that, they will keep pulling money out of the system to redistribute it in an unhealthy and bloated way

people who don't have kids deserved to be fucked in their old age. you didn't plan for the future, so suck a dick.

people who produced extra children will maybe help you.

Thing is: You either pay for your Pensioners that worked their ass off for 40 years or pay for low IQ Africans.

so importing them only cause more trouble than you already had.

Peterson said that you're basically useless under 85 or 90 IQ.

i basically assume i will never see a retirement fund unless i invest like crazy.

too bad i needed to start investing over 5 years ago to have any hope with a shit tone of money i could never have with the economy as it is

Importing low IQ people and muslims is not meant to be solution for pension system, it's meant to produce more votes for leftist parties.

so maybe i'll get luck and invest in something that does well enough to offset that.

You're European???

American.

If Trump gets the Wall and a second term there might be hope for you

The solution to the pension system is seen in our yearly inflation.

but in Europe, if we don't stop the Muslim Immigration and start deporting them, we will have a Civil war....

Approximately 6 trillion dollars of future debt value vanishes in the US due to inflation.

Every year at 3%

I'd say Abortion has played a role as well.

wasn't it like a Million babys killed per year in US?

In Germany the Abortion System is kinda nice.

You shouldn't count women that have children after abortion for this

So it's not much

you have to go to a 3rd party and talk with them, get a piece of paper.
Then you have to wait 72h after that.
With that you can go to a hospital and kill your baby

Stefan you seem reluctant to have a civil war in Europe, why?

Fewer children mean families have more time and resource per child. And apparently millenials have a had enough time adulting.

@Yuukimaru because I don't like war but have to admit that it is sometimes necessary for various reasons.
I don't like the thought of having a civil war, but the way its going, its inevitable due to fuckups from the Gouvernment....
And the Political divide in the west...

Fair enough

Just see the violence escalating or the political discrimination.

Germany seems to be a bit further down the line than the US 😦

Reduction in fertility is the best rebuttal against socialism imo.

i disagree with the convention that depopulation is a bad thing. no population is a bad thing, a population decrease from a the maximum a **healthy** ecosystem can supost is a bad thing, but depopulation within the most decadent population on the planet propped up soully on the progress generated by a quickly evaporating finite resource, whos growth had to push the boundrys of what the ecosystem could support every decade for the last 400 years to a point where it could barely maintain any other living animal with the same consumption needs as that, severly culling the natural territorys of hundreds of other species in order to make room for the artificual infastructure that population requires.

that depopulation? i dont really see as a bad thing, nor a perminant thing

It will fix itself anyway...

we are at the edge of where we can live comfertibly and we force feed other populations on earth to grow at the same rate we have and will eventually not be able to feed them. the mass extinction of human life isint going to happen in europe without unnatural interference, id aim a bit lower

theres a contanent on this planet with a billion people living on it and can likely only feed 100 million

and theres NO way to save them

well thats not true, but their starvation will come at the same time as modern societys starvation, modern society dispite its facade of empathy for other people is extremely selfish, especially the most decadent. they care about human life the same way a child does, they have so much so they give away to others but when they perceive themselves actually losing something, they will raise hell to keep it

I have lost all hope for Africa....

what really pisses me off are those Africanophile People, who don't know shit about the crap going on there...

and that "the white man" is not the issue there.

africa wont become extinct, it will simply have the greatest human death the world has ever seen on it

Yeah and we should keep our fingers out of there...

our fingers support 1 billion people there, keeping our fingers out is long long past us

Thing is: we feed them, they make more babys -> More people starve.

and that is a circle that won't end.

if the united states pulled its support out of africa fully you would see an attempted mass migration into europe that makes the current one look like a drip in the bucket, and the ideology of europe doesent know how to handle that right now. best case scenario they let them die, any other scenario is we lose europe

Exactly...

and the thing in Europe will be over before too long anyway...

nah i dont think so

The "right wing Nazi-Populists" are rising

they are trying to end europe but they have to deal with the eventual end of globalism at some point to and thats just a deck of cards built of a sand castle as the tide is coming in

They will fail because the native people are very unhappy with the radical changes and the people that came in in the last couple of years.

The reason for depopulation is often the issue tbh, as with Japan

whats most likely to happen is that the us wont pull out of africa until the entire world is threatened by an economic collapse, the world being in an economic collapse means that europe will also want to prevent damage to their economy, even the most ideological of them will realize that the horde will fuck them if they let them in, even those at the top will get fucked, and an economic crisis gives them the chance to be authoritarian without using international autruism as their defense for it, they would be able to argue national (or contanental) defense to rule with an iron fist and maintain their positions in government

Its society + Feminism.

It honestly mostly seems to be the corporate structure and lack of incentives to get involved in family-creating

Japan's got a bit of an existential crisis going on right now, from what I can tell

Yeah, that as well. Plus bleak future outlooks.

Suicide rate+lack of motivation (resulting, in some cases, in Hikkikomori) is not a good form of depopulation

they dont have enough room to maintain familys. not just future familys but even the ones they have now. this is a problem that america has to though its not quite as bad because we have a lot more room

I dont think it's limited to space issues at all

maintaining a family is more than just the nuclear family, the idea of the nuclear family is actually a foreign idea for humans that helped usher into society an idea that things could still be ok without your extended family, its no coincidence now 50 years later even that cant be achieved

```they dont have enough room to maintain familys. not just future familys but even the ones they have now. this is a problem that america has to though its not quite as bad because we have a lot more room```
America has a Problem with not enough room? Are you kidding?!
you have lots of desert and other undeveloped land....

But concentration of Population is absolutely a Problem. And I'd work towards depopulation of cities.

humans dont expand into developed land, only citys do

North America in general can support way more people than it currently does

And yet we're starting to get what Japan has

Look at Germany, that's about the size of Texas and has 80 Million people or so

we support several billion people i dont know what your talking about

yes europe is slightly more population dense than the us

U wot m8

You can't shoot in the woods in Germany.

beemann did you miss the conversation about globalism?

You want to know why?

Because its possible that you accidentally hit someone!

300 mil + 100 mil + 30 mil is significantly less than 2-3bil

The continent can house and feed significantly more than it has inhabiting it

more than half of africa, quite a bit of south america, a lot of china, a lot of india

though india is slightly more supported by europe than us

Im talking about overall sustainability

your talking about sustainability without international trade

If Japan's issue was density, we wouldn't be getting the same issues

japan would have a massive population drop without trade

Not going to address my point at all?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aging_of_Japan

theres more than coastline that can contstrain your populations ability to expand

We Americans need to get out of the cities

It’s killing us

There is pretty much nothing constraining expansion in NA other than people not wanting to leave cities

https://www.indexmundi.com/japan/age_structure.html

if the americans got out of the citys they would ruin the countryside

```We Americans need to get out of the cities```
Everyone needs to, not just the Americans.

and probably build more citys

people who live in citys are likely genetically different than people who live in countrysides even if they have the same ancestory only going back a few generations

@Arch-Fiend yes, but there’s such thing as “nuance”. More people in the countryside would probably change things but it could make the rural areas wealthier, and help reduce political radicalism as people of different backgrounds and ideas interact

Instead of being segregated as they are now

the people who live in the countryside are the people who CAN live in the countryside

The Problem began with the radical Idiots aka Atheists

That’s also a good point @Arch-Fiend

Dawkins, Harris are the one who caused the Problems...

+ the Neo Marxist Horse Shit without valuing the culture you have.

A lot of the people in cities moved there from the countryside, fyi

best thing you could do is reduce the number of restrictions you can maintain a society with that deal with people living in rural areas, but even doing that youll probably only get a 10% decrease in the urban population

I want to move out into the countryside

I live in a shithole....

the countryside is hard as balls nigga

Seems like it’ll be quieter, smell better, be less polluted, and less distracting

in Summer you need hours to buy a cucumber.

because there are so many people and the stores are not made for tens of thousands of people.

@Arch-Fiend nibba not everyone in the rural areas is a farmer

they are made for a couple of hundreds...

Just have a glass of water instead

and right now they are mostly empty (obviously)

today i was digging my garden up in 30-40 degree weather so i get to it before the ground freezes

Wait are you a farmer?

so you basicly want to be a city person living in the countryside?

>you're either a city person or a farmer
Wot

and thus increase the cost of living for anyone else living out there

C'mon, its not that shitty and there is space in some areas

because youll be increasing the population dencity of the rural area but the amount of land that exists purely to maintain the entire population of the country will remain the same thus the amount of land for ANYTHING besides farms will decrease

@Arch-Fiend Tourism is a bigger propblem than a couple of people moving to the country side.

I mean it’d probably be a sum good for more even population distribution. Lowering costs in overpopulated areas would make living in a state like California easier, and increasing housing costs in the countryside would, if anything, increase the wealth of the people living their as their houses become more valuable

especially seasonal tourism areas

its kinda that meme of communism where the guy is making room for things and chooses to leave out food except in this case we choose to leave out nature

Yes, I do not like the people coming from the city and living in rural areas but you don't live in a seasonal tourist area @Arch-Fiend
THAT is really awful!

if you evenly distributed every american across the entire united states you would have 85 people per square mile

Because from around June to End of August/beginning September its really awful to leave the house or go shopping...

@Arch-Fiend Imagin like 50-100k people in an area of around 182km²

thats called a city

For 4-8weeks....

oh wait

way less dense than a city

the other 10-11 Months there's 1/10th

oh im not arguing for citys

Nobody in their right mind is or should be

i just think maybe 50% or more of those people living in them should die before coming here

Cities are cancer if they are big enough

@Arch-Fiend Right now on the Island where I live, there are around 13k people.
But for 4-8 Weeks there are like 100.000 People here....

I’m pretty adamant on the need for redistribution of the American population, but I see your points @Arch-Fiend

it really wont matter

when we run out of oil it will happen anyway

Well, the Alt-Right is also for moving of Population 😉

Don’t they want to make Florida a black nation or something crazy like that

i dont really care about skin color, when you are facing the end of the industrial era it kinda doesent matter

Well, see what Jordan Peterson says about IQ....

iq wont be super important, it will help sure but africa had people on it before we artificially inflated the population there, iq is an envirnmental adaptation

iq mostly helps if you can use it to make your envirnment work for your survival

You're wrong on that...

look at what Jordan says about IQ.

and he's a rather leftish lefty...

The story about the guy folding letters....

what kind of psychologist is peterson?

A Clinical....

so the one that works with people and has seen them

so he understands evolution as much as a highschooler

If you want an evolutionary biologist you have to talk to the jewish gnome or the frenchman that started with the 7h Videos on youtube

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFxOxU9qQyQ

how about a real science

Yes, and??
Gad Saad said that the Race and IQ studies are taboo right now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAalq9lrjQA

The Race/IQ stuff is spicy, thus Research repressed...

i dont think research is repressed, im pretty sure its just not made public, ive seen lots of examples of genetisists finding links to iq in our genes

because the debate is kinda cooled down right now in my circle i havent really been keeping up on it though

That is not supresse

what is supressed is to research the difference between Asians, Europeans and Africans, especially in terms of IQ

actually ive seen genetic research on that too

And now look at average SAT Scores or similar studies in UK....

it shows that the curve you've known since the "Bell Curve", wich featured way more than that, is not wrong.
The SAT of black is around 85% of that from white people.