Message from Willem Petzer in Willem Petzer Live Chat #info-wars
I've read all of this, and I don't see a point in arguing it out, because it seems the arguments are ideologically driven, and quite honestly it looks like it is all based on fundamental misunderstandings of the concepts presented. That would lead to circular arguments that I don't believe progress could be made on. I will say I've presented astrophysics research to NASA. I am of fan of history and both models go back to ancient Greece, and proof being found all the way back then. I am also a pilot, and I can perceive the curvature of the planet with my own eyes at a surprisingly low altitude.
That said, there certainly is plenty of junk science out there. There is plenty of reasons to hate the education system/gov etc, without even having to go into anything they deny. They are open about so much nonsense they do, I see no need for even delving into conspiracy issues. I fear you have chosen the wrong hill to die on here.
Correct, it's ideological. Ideology plays a big role in our perception, and so ideology is essentially perception. On one side of the argument, there are people who have ideas, on the other, the perception that ideas have people. One side sees open minded people as conspiracy theories, the other sees the narrow minded as the conspiracy theorists. Even coming down to subjects as controversial as slavery, one side cannot fathom a reason to justify, the other perfectly capable of justifying it reasonably. It's flippen interesting to see how differently people perceive and reason. But yes it comes down to ideology, even those that reject ideology, are subject to ideology.
https://youtu.be/nUFMZkxochs?t=5375 (EXPERIMENT #1 Showing no apparent drift whatsoever)
(EXPERIMENT #2 - 6 hours - still no movement) https://youtu.be/IGPSjgv9t3E
""Idealogically driven" my arse.
Well it is ideologically driven... What else drives our ability to reason?
Definition of ideology. plural ideologies. 1 : visionary theorizing. 2 a : a systematic body of concepts especially about human life or culture. b : a manner or the content of thinking characteristic of an individual, group, or culture.
@Sheamus Our ability to reason is driven by our natural innate curiosity about the world. You know how curious little kids are? That ability is supposed to always be with us throughout our lives. We are supposed to try and fathom the unfathomable mysteries of life. And that is why the Educational Indoctrination system exists - to cure the curiosity and turn us into a tax-paying wage-slaves who thinks they know everything about the world and there is nothing more to learn. - If you're not curious about the world, you might as well be dead. EDIT Fixed typos
Yes agreed, i always like to think curiousity is the voice of reason. I'm open minded, and i see your perspective as well. But curiousity still doesn't take away from the fact that our understanding is based on our perception. Since we don't create it, only observe it, we therefore don't create ideas, but instead recognize ideas and willingly serve the good ideas and reject the bad, or ignorantly get enslaved by other ideas, deceptively believing it to be our own for profit most likely... (Those people that let their emotions dictate their reason, and exploit others feelings.)
Ideology is at the core of our ability to reason, curiousity itself is not reason, but it is the means that lead to intellectual stimulation, where as feelings the means of emotional stimulation. Some reason with with their feelings, others feelings dictate their reason. There's only one truth, but many lies.
@Sheamus Can I also just say that in order to be able to reason logically as well as think critically, one needs a baseline of truth - one major proven thing - and from there, all knowledge about the rest of the system can be deduced logically. And that is where the flat earth comes in. The most easily proven conspiracy of all time. Also the biggest.
@Sheamus "Ideology is at the core of our ability to reason". I have to disagree with that one. Ideology is a modern man-made contraption. My reasoning is driven by a thirst for truth. Has been for the last 20 years or so.
Yes, and that truth is an idea none the less. The idea of truth is a concept. And you have a collection or body of concepts that make up your understanding and help you understand how the pieces fit together, and how to interact with the world to get the desired results. This is what ideology is.
How do you define ideology then, if not a set of ideas and principles that influence our understanding and interpretation of our environment and solve our problems?
Correct, however, the nature of reality as we experience it every day is what I'm on about. All my Flat Earth arguments are based in hard science - not ideology. It is all about the Zetetic method of investigation, which is not to try and prove a point, but to examine and test and see what something actually is and how it works. And when you find out what the earth is and how it works, you will start getting an understanding of what a human being actually is. And when we find out exactly & scientifically what this place is and what we are... maybe then we can define our true purpose here on this earth.
I'm not disagreeing with you on that, but your method of science is an idea in itself, it's an idea of how to determine the truth. People can't agree on what the truth is because we can't agree on a means to determine truth, one prefers a method they themselves can apply and witness it for themselves, another prefers the idea that an authority they trust in tells them what the truth is. And this can be broken down into many layers. So as far as ideology goes, its real, it exists, that's what spiritual nature and realm is, that's what drives our cognitive experiences. Ideas really impact experiences and what we call reality.
You can't go and say you have no idea what truth or reality is can you? Let me repeat that. "You can't go and say you have NO IDEA what truth or reality is". You must have an idea, idea is the key-word in ideology.
Does a river need to have the idea of flowing down-hill before actually flowing down-hill? Or does it just do what's in its nature. Things can happen without an idea.
Lol nature is governed by principles, so is the water that flows with the idea of gravity... =)
Ah yes. Nature IS governed by a set of principles. And when you can accurately measure those principles, you may start getting a glimpse into the very nature of man. And isn't that what "Faith" is? An absolute understanding of the nature of your reality and your place in it? See how faith is the same as scientific proof? 😉
I'm out, night all.
Yes, and faith is in the principles, the idea you've been observing and know to be true. Understanding the idea to the degree that you can explain it confidently. But that's leading into another conversation, let's first find common ground on what ideology is.
Ek het die gesprek nou geniet...
May I ask why it matters?
Jy is welkom in saam in te spring, kop eerste.
Because sharing a common understanding is how we can continue to reason together, and ensure we don't have to wrestle with prejudices trying to distract us. If we can't bother to reason and find common ground, how do we expect to share the same space together?
Idealogy in my view is just one more form of social engineering / manipulation. We need to just be, in stead of trying to be something. Because at some point someone is going to write about about what he thinks we should be. Then for the rest of time everyone else who reads that book is going to try and be like that in-stead of living for themselves. Society as we know it is a gigantic fraud.
What is your opinion on the gold reserve? Do you think governments sold the gold to the aliens?
Okay so you decided to change the definition of ideology then... Based on what? Reason, or feelings... The heart is deceptive and desperately wicked; but who can know it?
Humility is a virtue, pride is a sin. I would suggest you give that some thought. I'm a little tired now, thanks for this, I'll definitely be back for more DeeJay, i enjoy your company.
@Daniebees interesting theory, I heard about it. Care to elaborate...
Same here talk tomorrow. Cheers
@Shiver ooh Thanks man, i actually like ambient music, . Very captivating playing subtly in the background. Can understand the purpose of the imagery too, captivating music with a captivating scene, conveniently a bad ass looking space pilot in an awesome looking roadster. Can entertain myself into that scenery with simple justifications, allows me to immerse myself into that idea.
How do you even like something on this thread? That made me chuckle, haven't seen that one yet. 😂
I just saw that one in the memes group, thanks for providing the chuckles 😆
So I've been curious for a while, where did the DA get all their funding from? Hmmmm I wonder where they bought those desalination plants from <:GWseremePeepoThink:402867838580293643>