but in the netherlands we don't really have a referendum culture. It only was introduced in 2015

Ahhh, so I'm guessing it wasn't part of your constitution then?

nope

OK, well still 25-30% sounds like a fairly good number.

Actually, if we're just talking about the number of people that need to participate, would it maybe be better to set it at something like 50-60%? That way enough people will have to know that it's unlikely that anyone didn't participate due to a lack of knowledge of the referendum.

I'd say between 30% and 40%

@Kelben

No, @Kelben

We have the participation quorum in Italy

it's the same problem

it should require 40% participation

50

50% quorum sounds like a good idea but it's not

@FroggyC why not? Also why did you @ me twice?

@Kelben sorry, didn't notice that I @'d you twice

Because if the quorum is too low who's against the referendum will campaign for not voting

No problem, I was just curious

It needs to be low enough that passing the quorum is almost always a significant risk

In that case who's against the referendum will not campaign for not voting, because they risk losing with a ~95% vote and that doesn't look good

Look at the history of Italian referenda

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Referendums_in_Italyhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Referendums_in_Italy

(the popular ones, which implement a 50% participation quorum system)

And see how many just didn't meet the quorum

Then look at how many won with a 90%+ vote

The only case in which both Yes and No campaigns went to vote is when the issue was very contested and it was well known that a lot of people would vote

Not only, if people against the referendum campaign for not voting, voting No basically helps the Yes campaign, as retarded as that sounds

Because by helping meet the quorum they make the referendum pass.

I hope I've been clear

from 1997 to now the only referendum that we passed was this one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_referendums,_2011, and it passed with a 95.4% Yes vote. Which doesn't represent the actual amount of people that wanted it to pass, because most people that didn't want it to pass just didn't vote.

Also it's problematic because you can see who goes to vote and who doesn't, so voting is not secret anymore, as it's clear that if you go vote you support Yes

OK, i see. And while I think this problem would be slightly medicated by the fact that referendums would not be set during their own special elections, but instead thrown onto the ballot of the next scheduled election, I can still see how everything you mentioned would still be a problem. Thanks for the help.

🇫 ℹ 🇬 🇭 🇹

Is internalizing your Identitarianism the alt-right version of internalizing Racism? 🤔

@HURR DURR ROCKY TOP i see you're a fan of the york <:Chad:426417002295459844>

Just saw a woman with a book about act like a lady think like a man. <:VeePalm:440213314677768194>

@D.kota tis my tribe

of course

The suicide tribe?

the york tribe

fuck lancaster

but what about tudor