And I never said that you said that.

oh I agree generational welfare exists

So I guess impasse.

I know fourth generational welfare recipents, i tried to help him learn to read

he was 25

but you are implying it

>my mind thinks something, therefore it is

yes

"I can read your mind, and know without making any investigations."

no I'm not, I'm not selfish and neither is anyone else who wants to put food into their own kids mouths instead of paying for some idiot on welfare to get another dime bag or grab another 6 pack, or even just to pay for his mersedes payment

and no, it's not Altruism, because paying for that shit has to be willingly done, not forced to do it

well just from your previous statements you are talking about choosing between sacrificing 1 person and the rest of humanity, I'm assuming that the person is you because otherwise that choice would be trivial.

But anyway, this really is just a cycle of "my opinion", then "your opinion." I have no idea what logical conclusions you've come to to decide what you've decided, but I'll probably leave you to it here pretty soon.

Oh yeah, if I had to be sacrificed, then fuck yeah

Sign me up

If the alternative is everyone else

Its not just my opinion, I am giving my rationale and you are rejecting it.

"My rationale"

"My"

"Accept my opinion as I dress it up as irrefutable fact!"

no you aren't

"You don't see it as fact? But I cannot fathom!"

you are trying to guilt people into accepting that Altrusim's definition is to be leeched off ot

*of

and it's not

and it isn't working

no, altruism's definition is to allow yourself to be leeched off of.

no it's not

because it neccessitates a sacrifice.

it's definition is to willingly help a person

you are the one not wanting to see it for what it truly is and are trying to force people to see it your way.

but who says that a society can't be altruistic but the people not?

Basically, what I was trying to get at is this: if I have to sacrifice for the good of humanity, sign me up. I don't even care if I'm being leeched off of, it's a purposeful leeching I fully consent to. And if the situation were to ever arise, I would never, in a _million years_ think of only myself. I'd be apprehensive as all hell, but I wouldn't _not_ sacrifice.

if you force a person to pay for someone and have them be dependent on you, it's not Altruism

I'm giving a part of myself to something I believe in.

And that's the part absolutely no one could ever take away from me.

In any concievable situation.

The part of me _wanting_ to make changes for the betterment of my kind.

but you are included in your kind

so you still are not performing a sacrifice.

"One of us suffers, so all of us must suffer"