While Athens was a democracy of about 500 people

Until it wasn't.

it had lots of eras

Dugin thinks the battle of Sparta and Athens is a story as long as history, namely, the conflict between continental Empires (Sparta, Russia) and Seafaring (Athens, USA)

Tyrant athens still > Sparta

He thinks continentals are naturally, superior

and characterized by idealism, ideology of soil, and spirituality

Athens is not a real seafaring empire.

yeah

Well, it also was in a way compared to other rivals

It just conquered places to get more men.

It was unmatched at sea, even by Persia

There's no distinction l

In how they actually work.

Yes but their conquest was typical mercantilist

Other than the Metropole is farther away.

I agree the distinction doesn't really make itself evident

they didnt want more men, instead they wanted trading privilleges and exclusive zones

martial vs. mercantile?

No, they pretty much showed up with a few hundred guys and took over your small City....

nah

yeah

it was all the same game

for everyone

i dont think martial vs mercantile is good division

British were both martial, and undoubtedly seafaring and commecial

just best-fitting what you said

fair enough

The only difference is Athens appointmented a military governor above the city government

And Sparta just appointed a military governor

I just mentioned Dugins position, I do not necessarily agree with it, though it has alot of merit

But nothing could be done without him.

Or if he died, chaos ensured usually.

Oh and killing him meant the Garrison sacks the city from the inside.

https://4threvolutionarywar.wordpress.com/2016/07/06/dugins-guideline-islam-is-different/

I also don't think Russia today is an archetypal example of a continental idealistic nation, when i think of it, no nation is today

yes, Dugin is philoislamic

he is Eurasian after all

The vast majority of Muslims are not traditional anymore

As they gain literacy

They pick and choose like everyone else.

Compare Aceh to the rest of Indonesia

I like this essay by him but it rings slightly hollow

opportunistic

hahahahaha

They pretty much are fundamentalists and would just sack it

If the government fell

The rest saxkinf the fundamentalists who are unpopular.

Islam, just like Christianity, has passed the point of it's possibilities, this is the only thing that Evola perhaps didn't understand

Also most of the places were Islam thrived were never honest societies

nope

Which is unrelated to the religion

Both Christianity and Islam HAD traditionalist schools, however, these existed IN SPITE OF their non-traditional teachings, not thanks to

they were literally underground movements

what are you referring to

with traditionalist

Sufism, Bektashism, etc

Bektashism is heretical, it isn't Islam

That stuff isnt underground but describes religious practices.

In Christianity it's more difficult to distinguish, but basically look at gnostics

Sufism

you mean Tradition, the esoteric meaning

@fallot that's what mainstream sunnis think about all whoare not mainstream sunnis, thanks for info

Unless of course you are describing militant Sufiorders who behaved like western military orders

no, they are simply not muslims due to their beliefs and practices

Like the Templars and Teutonic Knights

there are some basics to Islam

Fallot

Are you a capitalist?

Just like alevis

Well I mean alawites

Depends on what that means @Hagel, I don't support evils that are linked to the word capitalism

Bektashi order was basically Mithraic order for Ottoman Muslims, and it possese striking similarities

Alawites only decided to become sort of outwardly Muslims in the 30s

but I'm for the basic human actions of buy and sell

1930s

1. It was dominated by Janissaries, a warrior class, who didn't marry or have families

2. It was initiatic

Economics must be secondary to other goals

if necessary, I would be prepared to do stuff that is called "socialist"

Jannisaries had families

3. It was focused towards spiritual progression of warrior type, that is, detached

It depends.

@Death Strike's Bat When they served armed forces, mostly not, they were young boys with no contact with theri real families or backgrounds

Do you support fascist economics?

full gay mystical nazi

And eventually became herisitery state pensions for urban homos

@Hagel yes and no

They weren't young.

Planning capitalism and socialism based on each case

fascist economics tend to be pragmatic

Most were teenagers.

they married later sure, but in their service basically they lived the "mannerbund" life

yeah, like that

And most went back.

if by fascist economics there is a particular rigid system meant

then no

That is what I meant by it

To their home area

I mean I'm not against it?