Agreed and the method often used by females such as pills, often have a longer period of being able to recover from

Either way, my point still stays the same, there needs to be outlets for men to express these kinds of thoughts without the fear of being either shunned or ignored

From my understanding, both of those arguments are the leading contributors.

@lazzzycarrot(30) / senpai(40) the attempt at suicide rate does appear to be higher for women. However, actual suicides aren't just slightly more male, but closer to 3x more male (slightly more depending on age, slightly less if you stick to a more restrictive category like teen only).

Moreover, unlike what you may have heard, women attempt suicide only about 1.2x than men: https://afsp.org/about-suicide/suicide-statistics/

The 2x figure is based on ER statistics

I think we’re saying the same thing

We are saying similar things

My point is that those statistics aren't really explainable by "men are somewhat better at actually comitting suicide"

It is a possible explanation, but not something that is close to being demonstrated

I think the data puts "actual fatal results are higher for men since they tend to take more serious routes guns etc" in a bit of perspective

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3539603/

It’s a fact that men use more violent means than women

It is, but that's reaching. Men continue to have similarly inflated suicide rates even in the absence of the most violent means (firearms)

I don't believe there is a serious source that establishes that as the explanatory factor for the severity of the difference

It is *a* reason, sure, but it really shouldn't be used to explain the problem as a whole

Firearms were just one example that’s why I used etc. I understand where your coming from. However, I’m from the US so maybe using a gun was a bad example since they aren’t so prevalent in other sides of the world. But what is consistent in most studies is that the mode of suicide tends to be more violent which mean leading to a higher success rate

Yes, that is indeed consistent. But that leading to a higher rate doesn't explain the rate.

For instance, that study you cited showed nearly half of men and women who comitted suicide used the same method. Any difference in method literally cannot explain a 3x higher suicide rate in men

Did you read why they speculate that as well ?

Why were the women who attempted using that method more likely to survive? Because they then phoned an ambulance or someone was nearby to help?

InsaneCaterpilla, unfortunately, I've looked at the data and that particular explanation for why women attempt suicide more doesn't really explain the data either

I can't prove that explanation is false

but I can't substantiate that explanation as being worthwhile either

So I don't think it is a proper way to approach the problem

Mmm

@InsaneCaterpilla I can only speculate that women are more open to telling their problems

But I have no idea

"I can only speculate that women are more open to telling their problems" @lazzzycarrot(30) / senpai(40), I have a problem with that statement too, though my objection is considerably less data-driven. I **think** if you look into psychology, (though one has to be really careful with psychology studies as that is a feminist-dominated field) there is no good reason to suggest that men are really that worse at dealing with stress. Men and women are biologically different and handle stress differently in part because of this, and so those things are hard to directly compare. Rather, one *does* find that men are under (in many cases as a direct result of their own choices) more stress than women.

Yes, society's reaction to men being open about their problems is a significant issue

Dude read the article

but I'm skeptical about that as being the biggest issue

Half the things you have problems with they address

I've read that study before so it has been a while

so I'm not entirely up to date on it

give me a sec, I just got to the point where it "explains" the gender paradox

haha

Alright

Some gems

Gender conditioning might address the last point you made