@Son of Rome After the colonization people migrated to the US in huge numbers. The difference is most of them assimilated into the society of the country instead of refusing to recognise its customs and laws. We were a nation of immigrants, however that percentage has dropped a lot over time. We also were a nation of colonists, however that was generations ago. Now we're mostly a nation of "native born citizens".

More importantly, however, what the European colonists did to the native people of the Americas was absolutely abhorrent and unforgivable. Some of the natives were barbarians and savage and some were violent. However, some had a flourishing and healthy culture. In South America, there were massive cities with millions of people. It's recently been discovered. What wiped most of them out was the plagues brought over by the colonists.

You really need to rethink your understanding of reality. There's nothing that can be done now to fix it. Just like slavery, its in the past and reparations are a moronic idea for things that happened hundreds of years ago. However, it was still a terrible outcome.

Just like how right now innocent whites are being killed off and chased out of South Africa for the crimes of their forefathers. Do you think that also is a good thing?

There wasn’t a genocide of Siberian Americans. And slavery wasn’t has harsh as people make it out to be, like there wasn’t massive amount of rapes, in fact it was really rare. That’s North America anyway, idk about other parts of America.

The issue with integration nowadays is the fact Mexico is right there on our border, and that there really isn’t a border there at this point. People still speak Spanish, they aren’t Protestant but Catholic. And that they self segregate into their own communities and have essentially formed a entirely new Latin American nation in the South West USA.

Also our moral matrix has broken down completely, people are told to remain the same culturally when they move here. So there is absolutely 0 integration. And these people will out number us in 2045. So basically it’s ¡Adios America!

This is why some people want to break up the US btw, they want to salvage a part of the country from being dominated by Hispanics and not become a hated minority

"genocide of Siberian Americans"

You what mate

"Siberian Americans" I might start calling 'em that

They came from Siberia over the ice bridge

There were multiple waves from Siberia over the millennia

Slavery was actually pretty terrible.
There are some good things that came out of it and in some places slaves were treated more like indentured servants and members of the family which is much better. However, that was not the norm. The average mortality rate on the slave ships was 15%. That's abysmal. You're right that extreme abuse wasn't everywhere. However, it was common.

I agree about the integration of today's immigrants. I mentioned that problem in my original post.

Well the importation of slaves were banned pretty early on. And extreme abuse was pretty rare I’d argue. Because you wouldn’t damage the thing working on the field, that costs you money if you did that. I’m not excusing slavery, I’m just saying it wasn’t as bad as people say.

So you're saying 100% of slaves have made up 15% of casualties? That reminds me of another statistic.

What?

Speak English (EtBrooD)

I made a stupid joke don't mind me

Ahh okay, thought you were arguing a point

with half a pint in ya

A pint for a point

<:hyperthink:462282519883284480>

Also historical records show many slaves were treated horrifically. Other than seeing them as subhuman and treating them as such to reinforce their own ideology, slaves could be killed to set an example for other slaves (or tortured), such as if they escaped, refused orders or something like that. The reason wasn't to get more work out of that particular individual slave, but out of all slaves, be it in society (such as if they tried to escape), or if there were in a big group. And yes slavery inherently produces less value than wage-work, by a pretty wide margin, so by it's very nature it produces less. To argue that, they wouldn't do something that would result in less production of goods is frankly, pretty silly, since slavery itself does this. On top of this, they deliberately would shackle them, prevent them from learning how to read or generally be educated, and whip them which lead to infections and blood loss, just as a matter of course, which in no way long term is a good thing. There is such a thing as just being stupid and inefficient, and the nature of slavery leads to less productive labor in the first place, hence why they continued the practices.

@snake There were a couple different mindsets. One was to not kill or mame the slaves due to them being valuable. The other was to make sure they stayed subdued at all costs to prevent any thoughts of an uprising. Which was more common.

However, both mindsets are treating people like chattle to be bought, sold, dehumanized, and thrown away. Why are you defending that position at all, even indirectly. I'm confused.

Cause snake is an edgy teen

He hasn't grown out of it yet, give him time <:pot_of_kek:544849795433496586>

These people believe in ethnostates, hence they try to defend any edgey contrarian racist viewpoint. For example calling apartheid in South Africa "self defense". You have to remember what these people believe and how they will rewrite history to suit their ends

I try to stay away from generalities like "these people"

It derails productive debate

WEll it makes it easier than naming all of them and I think is more polite, it's not everyone in palaestra debates

But yes, there's a lot of edgey racism here, and they've formed some kind of group lol

Half of it is problably trolling, half of it is problably serious and it's intertwined xD

Clearly the purpose of Athens was always to set up a hu-wite ethnostate.

@everybodydothatdinosaur What is your view on what is currently happening in South Africa. I'm curious

Yes of course, after all Athens was a white ethnostate made up of Greeks <:hyperthink:462282519883284480>

What's happening in South Africa is pretty awful, and I think that racism of the past does not justify racism in the future, hence the treatment of descendants of oppressive people, or white people as a whole, not all of whom actually did anything to black people necessarily, should not be as if they were the oppressors. Furthermore stealing the land from farmers will only end in disaster, as when the new people take over and haven o idea how to farm the land, starvation will kick in. This same sort of thing has happened in Zimbabwe.

https://qz.com/africa/458137/mugabe-is-asking-back-the-white-farmers-he-chased-away/

I mean if they wish to walk into a disaster let them I do think we should save the farmers tho

The reality is that, like with most forms of socialism, racially motivated or otherwise, seizing the means of production tends to end in disaster as there is no-one better to run the land than those who, already know how to un the land. Replacing them, be it by black people, or in the case of say Russia with random Russian serfs, results in unskilled people in the positions and that just leads to famine. Other than it being immoral to mass rob any group of innocent people like this, it also will inevitably result in famines and the likely destruction of the farm which will, be absolutely horrific.

Thought you were going to end up defending the actions against whites in South Africa. The way you were talking came off as that kind of mentality. Glad I was wrong

Nah, I don't think it quite reaches the level of "whyte rice genocide", but I do think it's racism, and the fact many in the west flatly deny it only because the victims are white is disgusting. Written in to the law of these countries is oppression against white people, and laws specifically discriminating against them, and many will just outright deny it, or try to justify it and so on. What's happened is awful, and it's sort of racial-socialism

aka das naziism

Vietnam was like this, as were the Nazis xD