Message from @Soup Can Sam

Discord ID: 621789287284998154


2019-09-12 19:22:41 UTC  

I concede the isolationist point, but I’ll revise my list then

2019-09-12 19:23:00 UTC  

And replace it with a disregard for treaties and preference for working unilaterally

2019-09-12 19:23:41 UTC  

Except that they are not synonymous. I gave very specific definitions for these terms, of which are corroborated in dictionaries and search engines today. Are these sources of information not better to go off on instead of popular, often misinformed usage?

2019-09-12 19:23:53 UTC  

Of which terms

2019-09-12 19:24:20 UTC  

Fascism and Nationalism (and I guess by proxy Isolationism, but that's not exactly related right now).

2019-09-12 19:24:47 UTC  

Specifically, fascism in the context of the ideology prevalent in countries during WWII.

2019-09-12 19:25:32 UTC  

I think your definition of fascism is incomplete

2019-09-12 19:26:00 UTC  

Fascism always includes all the things I laid out, including a commitment to conservative social values

2019-09-12 19:26:13 UTC  

I mean it isn't though. If anything, your application of the term is far too broad.

2019-09-12 19:26:16 UTC  

Nationalism is, in a political sense, synonymous with fascism

2019-09-12 19:26:27 UTC  

My application is more narrow than yours

2019-09-12 19:26:46 UTC  

For instance, the Modi government is a fascist government, the BNP is a fascist party

2019-09-12 19:26:56 UTC  

Because again, conservatives are not the individuals who would overthrow the preexisting government.

2019-09-12 19:27:04 UTC  

That is simply not a part of conservatism.

2019-09-12 19:27:15 UTC  

Conservative social values? Do you mean conservative in the context of the US or conservative in the since of preserving existing policy?

2019-09-12 19:27:50 UTC  

I’m talking about conservative social values, not conservatism, though fascism/nationalism is of course on the far right of the conservative spectrum

2019-09-12 19:28:13 UTC  

And is within conservative movement’s, as it is in the US and as it was in Germany in the 30’s

2019-09-12 19:28:21 UTC  

The KKK is a fascist organization for instance

2019-09-12 19:28:24 UTC  

As was the silver legion

2019-09-12 19:28:29 UTC  

It actually isn't. Nazi Germany, for example, had elements from both the left and the right.

2019-09-12 19:28:38 UTC  

So you mean conservative in the context of the united states or whatever country you call home then

2019-09-12 19:28:38 UTC  

GG @Soup Can Sam, you just advanced to level 1!

2019-09-12 19:28:47 UTC  

The Nazi party grew out of the conservative German parties

2019-09-12 19:28:59 UTC  

Conservative according to what though?

2019-09-12 19:29:12 UTC  

The more moderate German parties believe they could use the Nazis to drive up populist support for their coalition

2019-09-12 19:29:13 UTC  

"conservative" isn't a catch all term with a set definition in terms of social implication

2019-09-12 19:29:34 UTC  

Conservative according to local tradition

2019-09-12 19:29:37 UTC  

Its entirely reliant on the current state of affairs and what society you are talking about

2019-09-12 19:29:44 UTC  

Well, sort of

2019-09-12 19:29:57 UTC  

Ok well then according to local tradition, the Nazi's were extremely progressive

2019-09-12 19:30:15 UTC  

Social conservatism is always about the supremacy of family values and a return to a more “upright” time

2019-09-12 19:30:24 UTC  

You’re conflating the social and political here

2019-09-12 19:30:34 UTC  

I'm really not

2019-09-12 19:30:48 UTC  

social conservativism is still directly related to the current society

2019-09-12 19:30:54 UTC  

So when I say German conservatives

2019-09-12 19:31:10 UTC  

I mean the German National people’s party

2019-09-12 19:31:16 UTC  

The conservative German Party

2019-09-12 19:31:38 UTC  

The Nazi's can't be grouped into either left or right because they literally utilized both ends to gain and maintain power.

2019-09-12 19:31:41 UTC  

Who wanted the Nazi party (which was to the right of them) to be a bulwark against the leftist parties

2019-09-12 19:31:49 UTC  

No, the Nazis were a far right party

2019-09-12 19:31:55 UTC  

They can be grouped only on the right