People insist the bible is objective, and sure, it is, but people certainly don't interpret it the way they're supposed to, do they?

hi

hello

i think it might be time to open the debate hall @The Big Oof

Not only that but even if god existed, so what if you did anything wrong?

bible is full of inconsistencies, to a point that it can be best described as a gestalt collection of subjectivist ramblings of several subsequent Levantine generations

@FreshWholeMilk But you're not inclined, to, which is why it's a rarity <:30yoboomer:521380551316209668>

Do people in China go around eating their babies and raping children?

you're going to need to point to that happening

rather than dealing purely in hypotheticals

What non-theistic country rapes children and eats babies?

Idk they eat dogs and that’s pretty fucked up

~~israel~~

(((The Bible)))

Eating dogs isn't really that weird, but I still think it's disgusting

Dogs are our eternal allies, but they're still not us, don't get civnatic.

human morality ultimately stems from our material reality and conditions - that includes stage of development, degree of scarcity and, yes, genes as well

the genome of man is probably unified in form enough for it to produce roughly similar ethical societies with slight variations here and there

so we can't say that we get our morality from the bible

we don't

its more the case that bible gets its morality from the material basis of man and his environment

I’m not saying that without God people will automatically do degenerate immoral stuff. Even without God, people still have a moral compass. But you cannot derive a coherent moral *system* from an atheistic worldview

"You don't get your morality from the bible, but let me tell you how you get your morality from the bible" is usually how the conversation ends

it's a compete cop out

> But you cannot derive a coherent moral system from an atheistic worldview

of course you can

Yes you can

How?

There are no coherent moral systems

They are all adhoc and serve a general purpose of maintaining a society

But they do not need to be consistent at all

morality exists pertaining to the relations between two or more people - or, in an expanded sense, it exists pertaining to the relations between two or more *sentient beings.*

as long as you have two or more sentient beings, moral frameworks for the organisations of their relationship can be - and always have been -devised

no god needed

First of all, what is, to you, a coherent moral compass?

But why should people obey those systems?

He's actually right

Because they’ll get punished if they don’t

People think survival of the fittest is a solo game

it's not

While these relations exist, if there is no higher motive there is no motive to follow them

Just how if you don’t listen to god you’ll burn in hell

it involves teamwork by its very nature

Well, God is inherently good, so anything that conforms with the will of God is inherently good