Message from @Mozalbete ⳩
Discord ID: 579310244803641375
I would say inherited corruption, but still the focus is on corrupt nature, inclination towards sin with sinful desires etc, so even if there is some disagreement I doubt it is a big deal
Sinning is an action
What I've been taught is that sin is not natural and is sort of a consequence of our free will
? @Mozalbete ⳩ I forget that people don't understand that they are dead. Matthew 8:22
**Matthew 8:22 - New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)**
```Dust
<22> But Jesus said to him, "Follow me, and let the dead bury their own dead."```
Sin is a thing that you have to willingly partake of
I forget that they don't understand that "In the day that Adam and Eve ate the Fruit THEY DIED." God is not a liar.
Because that death is the departure from God and the true life
Exactly, we are all dead. We are all in Hell. Jesus came to Hell to redeem what he could and see that people were born into Life.
Lmao we are not in Hell, that is what awaits to those who die (as in, the normal death we all understand) while not in a state of grace
I don't understand what point you are trying to make
😃 We are most definitely in Hell (you must live a very sheltered life). This is why The Son of God died and came here to redeem us...because he LOVED US.
There is no salvation in Hell, so we are most definitely not in Hell
The second sentence you said is unrelated to the first one
Consider the difference between Heaven and this place. This is Hell
For some reason you seem to imply that God only loves us if we are in Hell
Lmao differences are one thing, and being in Hell is another one
There is redemption in Hell. God is Everything, Everywhere. We are sinner, fallen, dead in Hell and God wants us to be Born Again.
To what extent one could consider the lack of fire be an extension of the worst parts of this life, I don't know
Christ descended into Hades and freed the souls trapped there
This is not hell. That is some strange talking point.
Take for example the parable with Lazarus
Yes...US IN HELL @Jay Dubya
And many more ways in whic we are told to be prepared
That sounds like some bizarre nonsense from the 1800s
John 12:32
**John 12:32 - New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)**
```Dust
<32> And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself." ```
We are born again in baptism
You've seen too many movies or listening to too much edgy music
That is some new age nonsense
Luke 16:19-31
**Luke 16:19-31 - Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)**
```Dust
<19> There was a certain rich man, who was clothed in purple and fine linen; and feasted sumptuously every day. <20> And there was a certain beggar, named Lazarus, who lay at his gate, full of sores, <21> Desiring to be filled with the crumbs that fell from the rich man's table, and no one did give him; moreover the dogs came, and licked his sores. <22> And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom. And the rich man also died: and he was buried in hell. <23> And lifting up his eyes when he was in torments, he saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom: <24> And he cried, and said: Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, to cool my tongue: for I am tormented in this flame. <25> And Abraham said to him: Son, remember that thou didst receive good things in thy lifetime, and likewise Lazareth evil things, but now he is comforted; and thou art tormented. <26> And besides all this, between us and you, there is fixed a great chaos: so that they who would pass from hence to you, cannot, nor from thence come hither. <27> And he said: Then, father, I beseech thee, that thou wouldst send him to my father's house, for I have five brethren, <28> That he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torments. <29> And Abraham said to him: They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. <30> But he said: No, father Abraham: but if one went to them from the dead, they will do penance. <31> And he said to him: If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they believe, if one rise again from the dead. ```
Lifted up, born again...from the dead
Born again as opposed to our corrupt predisposition towards sin
You have to want to stay in Hell, I guess...if you are going to remain here
Genesis 1:1-31
The passage is too long for me to grab, sorry.
Hue
Just use 2 parts
Rip