@Arthur Grayborn “The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognized by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.

Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security.”

That's the wording of Article 5

WW1 was caused by SECRET alliances. People would have reconsidered going to war if they knew what the fuck they were getting into.

What's stopping a nation from attacking another and then invoking article 5 when a retaliatory strike comes?

@King Canuck
>tell them about the Leftist who killed people

we wre over that earlier

Connor Betts, I think?

we agreed it was a moot point cause his ideology didn't make him shoot people

🤔

he just seemed to be a violent boi

That's true of the majority of shooters iirc

@King Canuck What's their opinion on the El Paso shooter?

"But he wasnt a real Leftist"

https://www.commondreams.org/views/2017/12/17/no-eastward-nato-expansion-sorry-chump-you-didnt-have-it-writing

They fucked Russia by expanding

Russia is retaliating

Nothing controversial about that

Im not saying that applying pressure to russia is fair, or that its wrong for russia to push back

@Weez - Maybe Russia should ask why all of their former colonies are so eager to join the Americans.

Russia has corrupt political systems built into it that seek to ever expand way outside their remit

ones that are not commiserate with western values in the slightest

if you just let them do whatever they wanted all of east europe would be on fire right now

The Soviet Union used to be massive, and most of those former Soviet satellite states practically BEGGED to join NATO. Even though they're former Warsaw Pact states.

I doubt that @Kealor

my dude

if russia doesnt want to expand

why would they care if someone stopped them from expanding

@Arthur Grayborn They can beg all they like. Inviting them added fuel to the fire.

That's all I'm saying

Inviting them and allowing them in made the issue worse.

It's called oppression and colonialism, @Weez. Everyone the Russians oppressed is looking for an ally to make sure it doesn't happen again.

People who couldn't get the alliance ended up suffering exactly what they feared.

Russian boots on their soil, Russian government pushing them around at gunpoint.

@Arthur Grayborn Good for them. Let them make their own pact.

Weez either you think russia wants to expand, or you think that nato doesnt affect them

pick one

Russia is expanding as a result of NATO expansion.

hahahaha

LOL. No it's not.

"i only rob banks because they are hiding money from me"