Henlo retards

free will in the way we describe it is the ability to act without the constraint of fate or determination.

in this sense, i do not beleive free will exists.

well any thing in linear time is determined

Hmm

however, free will does not necessarily have to be this definition.

if your will is perfectly alligned with fate,

there is no issue.

well yes there is often a confusion by the ability to make choices with a will, and complete freedom from causality which is silly

and, look at that, by nature of how our universe works

it is.

funny

well everyone is fated in a sense, as there will be a time at which our activity terminates and then it could be described in exact scientific detail and no matter what we choose that is true

@☭ Anon ☭ Not really, no. I'm willing to concede most of the precepts of determinism, including the idea that one can reach new conclusions deterministically. However, I don't see a way out of the contradiction brought about when beliefs, desires, and/or temperaments conflict with each other.

our desires are shaped by biology and our exposure to external stimuli

@vespertilionineVigilante I would say that is simply a lack of self comprehension no? As the beliefs fight they are synthesized into a amalgam of sorts

if you were sufficiently clever, and could look in someones head such a conflict could be graphed and modeled at all points i think

For example, suppose I am deliberating over whether or not to eat a bowl of ice cream. I feel like having the ice cream (temperament), but I also believe that resisting it will lead to a more desirable outcome in the future (desire). How do I make this decision? My point is that comparing temperaments to desires in this case would be like comparing apples to oranges unless I adopt a paradigm of thought that states that one is categorically superior to another.

Your subconcious assigns utility values and bellies you out of indecision based off of your accumulated preferences, which are in turn based off your experiences and internal thoughts

but it is closer to the distilling of a complex situation to a gut animal reaction

than some enlightened choice

But why make decisions according to utility at all?
I'll put it another way: Why operate by beliefs as opposed to desires and temperaments? It can't be reduced to a belief that operating by beliefs is better since that would be begging the question. It can't be reduced to either of the other two either because then we would be operating by desires or temperaments and the same circular logic would occur (desiring to operate by desire & feeling like operating by temperaments). None of these three fundamental causes can explain why I chose one over the other. What can?

Your gut animal faculties and genetics with only minor consideration to things like beliefs, desires and temperaments which are ultimately just structures of language in your head you've assigned various values. The freedom we have is ultimately only to construct an instruction manual for our instinctive stove-touching bodies to face the world and we don't comprehend the ultimate moment a decision is made . However I do think the mind in its sanctuary is free enough to tune and twist the language which is important to it, and thus defines behavior outside of the basic level.

but overall the same animal body which ran from predators and associated smells and sounds with danger or gives you social warnings is what drives you moment to moment

Can we take some time to appreciate

That

Someone made a Dodo-Tyrannosaurus Rex hybrid

😳

*bap*

Those different values we interpret as beliefs, desires, and temperaments are still not directly comparable, though. Animalistic instincts and genetics often determine what our temperaments are in various circumstances, but they don't determine why we weigh beliefs or desires as more valuable than our temperaments or why people change their paradigms of thought.

Well that is exactly what I was implying, that in constructing or changing paradigms of thought is the only place where will can be said to exist but it is a slow process and you don't really make decisions you build belief stuctures so when you come across a decision you frame it in your structure and then follow the value structure you built

And so far as we have will, it is only over the course of long days of introspection to change the fundamental methods by which our careening chemical clockwork reacts to the world

Yes, exactly

for example if you were to come across a time sensitive problem that required agonizing, your decision would ultimately be predictable based off your recent thought lest you decide to overturn everything at that given moment which would likely take too long and so we can only set up rules to be followed later unless time is no factor

yall need some <#552589453202554891>

People operate by certain paradigms that can change gradually over time, yes

>no pantheism role >no anprim role

oofed

🤡