"not real socialism" is also shit tier argumentation, kiddo

Gotta split hairs to defend a murderous ideology.

over 70% of hungarians said life under socialism was better

same with serbians

i'm sorry but capitalism isn't socialism

I was given my managers word that this would never happen again.

norway is closer to being a socialist country than venezuela

I'm sorry, but venezuelan economy isn't failing due to implementation of further capitalist policies

That's not what I've heard before.

they are failing for similar reasons to why they did in the 80's

Norway isn't stealing capital from random companies

It's my understanding that socialism done goofed the whole country.

norway has a bigger public sector than venezuela

"said was better" means nothing when they don't know any better. The only way you can make healthcare under Socialism look good is with subjective opinions of citizens that never knew what good healthcare looked like.

what do you mean they don't know any better

they literally lived under socialism and then lived under capitalism and liberalism for 15 years

But bro, muh Scandinavian socialism!

scandinavian countries aren't socialist

having a large public sector does not make you socialist

and neither is venezuela

i agree mal

you can gave a large public sector within a capitalist economy

but by what metric could you consider venezuela to represent the collective ownership over the means of production and not norway

Norway has free market economy.

so why did you say norway was closer to venezuela to socialism, when that clearly isn't correct. Which one of those two countries are stealing capital from random companies, because they think they have the right to it?

norway is closer because they have a bigger public sector, less of their labor force are employed in capitalist employer-employee relationships than in venezuela

no, a larger public sector does not make norway closer than the country that steals capital.

why not

they've expropriated a very small portion of the private sector

any portion at all, makes them more socialist

in fact venezuela's public sector was bigger in 1997 before chavez was elected than in any year during his tenure

that's dumb as fuck

violating property rights in certain scenarios doesn't make them closer to being socialist, you have to look at the actual mode of production

it could be used as a way to move toward socialism

You're defending violent socialist policies, and saying they're less important to establishing whether or not a country is socialist, than the relative size of the public sector.

they are basically irrelevant

when you are describing the mode of production as it currently exists

so what are these "certain scenarios" that are exempt from your considerations?

by certain scenarios i mean they haven't like banned private property or expropriated the overwhelming majority of it

they have expropriated very specific things

in norway, it is allowed for a government to expropriate property, if a public road has been planned, but the owners have to be compensated