Message from @Zuluzeit
Discord ID: 777286584869191700
Yup. In a ranked choice system the political parties lose power, giving more power to individual politicians who can now gain more nuanced support. So it will sadly never happen
Maine is using the ranked system for voting
if you want levity, try this: https://youtu.be/Cdd8QRi_OvI
A little too narrow. Would be better to listen to deep throat.
Follow the money.
There are many ways to interfer with elections. Nazi germany openly erected organisations for this purpose in the 30ies. They were dealt with.
One can not expect countries like south africa to deal with foreign influence effectively, but one would think America could have addressed this earlier. For some reason that has not happened.
On the other hand, can you really complain if you build a brothel in Gotham city and it fills up with saudi princes and chinese bankers?
That's scary
IMO in this entire discussion we need to reverse the standard of proof. Any election needs to prove it was a valid measure of the voter's will. All the election laws and standards are designed to supply the means of proving that. Thinks like registration, voter id, ballot integrity, vote anonymity, observation and challenge processes, document retention. If all these are followed, it provides the required standard of proof beyond a reasonable doubt. When these standards are eroded, obstructed or applied unevenly, reasonable doubt in the results is introduced.
This is the philosophical basis of election validity; not sure how it stacks up legally--but the "nothing to see here" crowd deliberately ignore this reality.
After all, isn't an election certification also a government decision, just as a court finding or executive action? Shouldn't it be based on due process and a standard of proof that sides with the people against the government?
It's siding with the people as we speak with our judicial system as the arbitrating mechanism designed to do precisely that. Further, if you're suggesting that all these claims are operatively vaild until someone figures out a way to prove absence of existence, you're going to be disappointed.
A good way to engage the "'nothing to see here' crowd" should not have included every hysterical, ridiculous on it's face accusation which relies upon ignorance of controls which are, in fact, in place. That was self inflicted and I imagine many credibility ships have sailed. Moreover, only already credulous people are impressed by volume.
So you're all good with zero signature verification combined with unlimited ballot harvesting and thousands of extra ballots floating around the populace? Still nothing to see? Even if no more specific election fraud is ever proven, you have to concede that election design is hopelessly flawed. The trendline of such a configuration can only benefit those already in power.
I'm speaking philosophically. This has no legal impact. The question is, was this a good election? Is this how we should do this? What do we want to change for next time? That's the role of philosophy
I suggest that the established, unidirectional burden of proof is appropriate in both senses of the discussion. I would philosophically argue that controls are very much the proof you're suggesting and that's not by accident. All you're really saying is that we need more controls...and I would agree that there is no such thing as too much regulation. I have no idea the scope of what is in place (I don't think you do either) but would endorse introducing more controls, yes.
No. Were saying that the controls that are there weren't applied. That's what the statistical evidence shows when looking at ballot rejection rates and extremely high # of single vote ballots specifically in swing states that went for one candidate, but not in the states that went for the other
No it won't. Statistical evidence doesn't work to prove voter fraud.
Maybe there is a reason for that?
Sure. Doesn't mean we actually had a fair election
Doesn't mean we didn't. I think we're right back at burden of proof.
It just means we couldn't rise to the burden of proof
Yup.
Yet.
Maybe later but right now, nope.
It means that it's likely we didn't have a fair election. Not proof. Likely.
You get enough of those and bye bye republic
They've been trying to destroy the republic for a very long time. Is this the straw, you think?
1.5 people ago we almost broke apart
Literally over this exact issue
Maybe putting all faith in a republic on the fate of one person isn't the perfect method.
Luckily they thought of that.
> You get enough of those and bye bye republic
@DrSammyD it's already "baked into the cake" ... can you say "currency collapse?"
https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/executive-order-imposing-certain-sanctions-event-foreign-interference-united-states-election/
On september 12 2018 Trump declared a national emergency which means that the 2020 election. This national emergency specifically refered to foreign interference in the US elections infrastructure.
This is all documented in the above executive order. The order says that the election infrastructure which includes software systems is being compromised by foreign actors. In addition to declaring the national emergency this executive order empowers the treasury to seize all assets of persons(and organizations/corps, companies, etc..) engaged in or covering for foreign interference or in spreading propaganda to mislead or deceive the US.
HERE IS THE IMPORTANT PART: The dominion company is based in CANADA and Scytl another voting software company used is run out of Spain. So we have foreign interferance in US elections. No wonder we had so many glitches leading to vote swapping and deletion. This is clear foreign interference into US elections.
Every media organization that has lied about foreign interferace and voter fraud can be seized and shut down by the treasury department. There is venezuelan money, chinese money and money from political PACS involved in dominion which is itself Canadian.
Then there is also the 14th amendment, section 2 in particular which says that any state engaged in a rebelion against the US shall have it's electoral college votes stripped away by the president.
Then there is section 3 of the 14th amendment which says that every person who has taken an oath of office and sworn to protect the US constitution(Mayors, governors, senators, etc..) can be arrested and charged with treason for aiding a rebellion against the USA.
Now check this out: Many US votes counted in Spain:
https://greatgameindia.com/us-election-bankrupted-spanish-scytl/
We have zero idea if the voting software was sabotaged intentionally or not.