@Corndog you start form the neutral of no fraud (like every other election) , you don’t start with mass voter fraud and demand you prove it to be false otherwise we cannot go further, we have never done that for any election. This is just Trump telling people there is fraud and just running with it.

Coming from a position of utter incompetence, I thought cyber-warfare was taking out eachothers infrastruture by means of computer sabotage?

@Recalibar without a doubt it's sketchy and archaically designed around 1776 notions of an election.

But when I think cyber war I think infrastructure getting torn apart... Like reactor meltdowns.

right

and coms

I disagree that is the neutral stance. Can you support that claim that it is normal there is not fraud in an election?

Or a system of malicious actors working to undermine the US government in tandem... like a US election. I can't back up such a claim except with what's being discussed on the table.

@Recalibar, you just advanced to level 8!

You got to leave the com up until the rest of the infrastructure is toasted.

"Big, if true."

@Recalibar That I know. That is called asymmetric warfare.

And it is certainly in effect all over the globe.

since 1776. 😄

when france payed for a certain revolution.

Preponderance of evidence standard in the court will be what counts and so the assumption will be no fraud occurred unless it's proven based on that standard.

If you want to argue State actor stuff the ballot box in states where ballots were mailed out willy-nilly, that could be another story.

You already got this Coronel talking about Iran and Choyna running ballot switching efforts through Dominion being presented before state legislatures.

See where I'm getting at?

There should be another layer of authentication added to ballot requests.

@Recalibar Ya. I regard that as propaganda, until someone can show me something.

@Corndog no the claim is there is fraud every election but not enough to make a difference. Your position puts trumps election into question, Obama, bush etc

Mail out of pin code or pass number with the number to call to request the actual ballot this number calls back the first.

So you can make certain the end user collar isn't spoofing.

Fair enough, and it's reasonable to say so. It's just strange to me how we've all been talking about the Russians and foreign interference for the last 4 years and then presume all of a sudden it didn't happen.

@Recalibar But being a complete computer moron, I probably would not recognize any such documentation if it was standing in my garden with bright flashing neon lights saying: "I am proof of computer-election-fraud"

@Recalibar Most major geopolitical actors are constantly trying to sabotage eachother by all means proper. Since Herman flipped on Rome.

Neither would anybody in Georgia which is why the Secretary of State insisted that they had paper ballots and why they eventually counted them by hand.

good to know I am not the only moron, then.

Sending unrequested ballots is a fool's move.

It kind of makes me think whoever did it is trying to so the seeds of discord.

Certainty is akin to fallibility in this world. Nobody should be certain of anything. I'm not even certain that the Russians didn't interfere directly with Dominion as a part of these allegations back in 2016.

@meglide To tell you the truth I joined mr. Grulers discord over my interest and work in criminal law. I am hoping this election stuff goes away. Until then, carry on.

I second this.

There's a whole big world full of them out there, rest assured

Right my point is when this is being dragged out an not heard in a court. It’s reasonable to say we don’t know until it is heard. The history of voter fraud not being enough to overturn elections in the past holds some merit, however, that would assume there are comparable elections. No election has taken place during COVID style restrictions and implications. That leaves the door open for all possibilities.

I found him on accident over election stuff and have greatly appreciated his take on what we see. I will continue once the election is past though. Criminal law is intriguing.

The Chinese are the only ones with the power to actually be able to scale receiving requested mail ballots.

I don’t think those elections are comparable. Why do you say that?

@Corndog, you just advanced to level 5!

Not to mention they have the embedded back doors in chips...always makes it nice and easy.