NOR IS THE SUBCONSCIOUS

again, disagree

but keeping that aside

HOW ARE YOU USING THE TERM "SYMBOLIC" HERE?

symbolic: visually encoded truth/information carrier

symbol = the external and the inner vision associated

both

so what the symbol is explicitly and what it implies

would both be the symbol, else it's just a pictogram or something

or a word

I mean I'm not out to convince you of what is prior and what is not, but I just wanted to clarify

that this is where I was coming from with that

VISUALLY ENCODED TRUTH

And the essential thing, psychologically, is that in dreams, fantasies, and other exceptional states of mind the most far-fetched mythological motifs and symbols can appear autochthonously at any time, often, apparently, as the result of particular influences, traditions, and excitations working on the individual, but more often without any sign of them. These "primordial images" or "archetypes," as I have called them, belong to the basic stock of the unconscious psyche and cannot be explained as personal acquisitions. Together they make up that psychic stratum which has been called the collective unconscious.
The existence of the collective unconscious means that individual consciousness is anything but a tabula rasa and is not immune to predetermining influences. On the contrary, it is in the highest degree influenced by inherited presuppositions, quite apart from the unavoidable influences exerted upon it by the environment. The collective unconscious comprises in itself the psychic life of our ancestors right back to the earliest beginnings. It is the matrix of all conscious psychic occurrences, and hence it exerts an influence that compromises the freedom of consciousness in the highest degree, since it is continually striving to lead all conscious processes back into the old paths

-Jung

THIS CONCEPT IS NOT CONSISTENT TO ME

the word encoded is a best-fit

WHAT HE CALLS SYMBOL IS MORE ACCURATE METAPHOR

OR KENNING

dunno what a kenning is

IS CONSCIOUSNESS FUNDAMENTALLY METAPHORICAL? IT WORKS BY COMPARISON

I think at the base level

consciousness is yes, fundamentally "metaphorical"

KENNING = THE USE OF REPEATED TROPES, LIKE "THE WINE-DARK SEA," TO EXPRESS CONTINUITY OF MEANING IN A WORK

i.e. as dreams

YES, I CAN AGREE WITH THAT

BUT INTUITION IS NOT SOLELY THAT

IT IS ALSO DIRECTION

AND SENSATION WHICH IS INDEFINED BECAUSE IT IS AT A LEVEL LOWER THAN CONSCIOUSNESS

sure, but nevertheless, it would derive from that realm

MORE LIKELY THE OTHER WAY AROUND

intuition would sniff out the truth or deeper meaning in metaphor

METAPHOR DERIVES FROM INTUITION

INTUITION IS THAT THERE IS ORDER, WHICH MEANS REPEATED STRUCTURES, AND THEREFORE METAPHOR WOULD WORK

there would be metaphor as understood, but there would be an ur-metaphorical source I think

AND SO WE RELY ON IT AS EXPRESSION

again, Jung

in the above, what Jung calls "primordial images"

UR-METAPHORICAL = THE INTUITIVE CONCEPT OF ORDER, I WOULD THINK

"ARCHETYPES" IS AN ESOTERIC CONCEPT

THINK OF IT THIS WAY