if the supreme court interpreted "life, liberty, pursuit of happiness" to include the right to healthcare it would have markedly different effects than just going to single payer healthcare by a law enacted by congress

why dont peope just call it the way it is "i think government should pay for people's healthcare"

why do shitlibs just have to state everything in abstract ideological maxims

because "right" sounds better than "entitlement" i guess

it's the same on both sides, it's how people think

and also, they make it a moral issue

yeah

as it follows from their first principles

and for that matter so does the opposition, because similar first principle issues

American healthcare is a big, rotten, corrupt mess, perhaps partially by design

Positive rights are cancer

healthcare in particular is worrying because it's not a demand that can be satisfied

you can spend infinite money on it and everyone will still die

@The Enlightened Shepherd how else do you ideologically subvert the base culture?

you're stretching it to absurdity @UOC

be fair

of course everyone will die

Point is, scarcity exists for it

I work in the NHS, it is a big mess too

I am, but it's already one of our biggest budget items here.

but I can see at the same time, it has considerable merits

and if there was a private setup parallel to it

it would be faultless

I have no problem with reform, including reform to a single payer system

shouldn't healthcare be a big budget item though?

it makes sense to me

it seems reasonable to me that when so many people (a nation) get together

that its for some good mass effect

Why not socialize food production ?

Maybe, if that's what it costs. I'm just exploring the problems with listing it as right vs. an entitlement. If it's a right, it's much harder (in our system) to place limits on it

doing that to a degree is also not a bad idea

Isn't food a right?

healthcare is simple

yeah, if healthcare is, food is just as much I guess

spend according to your possibilities

full stop

We all Know what that crap leads to

getting in debt to fund continuous healthcare demand is as dumb as it can get

do we? I'm not talking about complete socialization

Rationing that hurts everyone

again, stretched to absurdity