Message from @Kenpachi
Discord ID: 523627610878509066
wait a minute...
It’s sad what happened to Flynn war vet and the fbi had a perjury trap for him sad Comey even admitted that he got away with it in an interview different standards from Clinton over trump
@McBacoon President Trump is amazing
He has destroyed the horrible Conservative establishment in favor of something much better
He has made progress with North Korea. N and S Korea are now talking about joint Olympic bids, connecting the countries together through infrastructure like railroads, constantly meeting, etc. American hostages have been returned. They have stopped missile tests and blew up some launch sites.
Trump got us out of the horrible Paris Climate Accord, which is causing riots in France, even though it's completely non-binding and countries like China can use it to take advantage of anybody who does follow it.
Trump is taking a stand on border security
Our economy is doing really well, including very low unemployment rates, especially among minority groups.
Trump is not perfect, nobody is, but he's doing pretty dang well.
^
@atheist4thecause I can't agree with most of that but it's mainly all point of view.
I personally think Trump ran all the smart adults out of the Republican party in place of populist stooges. They can't do math, and tend to hate everyone else. I don't see that going well.
There isn't as much progress as the right likes to boast about with NK, but there has been some and I won't take that credit away. There is not physical connects of the two countries besides the DMZ points (still the same.) I personally have no respect for hostages dumb enough to go to a country that consistently does so.
Paris wasn't a bad deal, but most people haven't read it. (It's not the cause of the riots, a series of taxes is.) That being said, it was redundant.
The economy has been growing for 10 years, laying a good economy solely at the foot of anyone is just silly.
My personal politics don't align with Trump well, but he has been effective by the numbers. Problem is, him and his supporters tend to be complete assholes. If results were all that mattered, the Republicans would have had a 60 seat Senate and a 300 seat House. However, they are so bad at pissing people off they ran 1/8th of their collation out of the party.
lmao
```He has made progress with North Korea. N and S Korea are now talking about joint Olympic bids, connecting the countries together through infrastructure like railroads, constantly meeting, etc. ``` they will never connect lmao, while yes, gratz to him making SOME progress, it is still small steps. The olympic bids dont mean shit really as the northern home view is still bad and the countries wont be linked together by infrastructure projects, lmao what infrastructre could you possibly have when you have the most heavily guarded border on the earth with millions of mines and one side every now and then promising to nuke the other side. and there can be no trade as they have maxxed out sanctions. ```They have stopped missile tests and blew up some launch sites.``` that is temporary, NK did that some 20? years ago aswell, and look where we are rn. NK is behind the table because they had a very rough last winter and china pressured them aswell. ```Trump got us out of the horrible Paris Climate Accord``` yes, because a world that looks stright out of Mad Max is the future we need, vote 4 me 2020 plz. ```Trump is taking a stand on border security``` and I havent seen any progress from it tho... ```Our economy is doing really well, including very low unemployment rates, especially among minority groups.``` thats because the whole world does great economically, increased demand= ecnomic growth. And minority groups dont really matter now do they?
@McBacoon damn, I agreed with every point.
If Hillary was president right now we would be at war with North Korea everyone forgets that trump is the only us president to ever meet with North Korea’s leader
289 accomplishments in 20 months unreal and so overlooked
Back when the article was published even more now
The list is so long maybe I’ll post all 289 accomplishments and those are just from his first 20 months lol
@McBacoon The railway system has already gotten approval to go ahead for research by the UN, and South Korea is sending engineers and resources to study upgrading North Korea's system for the connection to South Korea: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/24/world/asia/north-south-korea-rail-un.html -- If you want to argue this will never happen, you need to at least explain why and preferably give some hardcore facts instead of just projection.
As for the joint Olympic bid, that's more meaningful than you make it out to be. Hosting Olympics costs a lot of money and takes a lot of organization. It also makes a lot of money in tourism. Just sitting down and making the plan means something, but also if they ever won (admittedly unlikely), that would be huge for working together and North Korea opening up.
On missile sites, blowing them up is permanent. Sure, they can rebuild or have other sites, but blowing up sites is still permanent. The reason North Korea had a rough winter btw, is because of the pressure Trump put on them. China leaned on them because of Trump.
On the PCA, you're just being ridiculous, like with the rest of my points. Make some real objections. The PCA was opposed by environmentalists at the time because it is not legally binding. It was an economic agreement that asked countries to promise to self-regulate to certain goals. It did nothing. It will only punish those who follow it, and it will benefit those who don't. (France follows and has riots.) This does not mean we need Mad Max. We can solve the problem in other ways. We are more likely to solve the problem because we aren't faking it in the PCA.
On border security, Trump did persuade many in the Caravans to turn back. They have been catching illegals at solid rates. Prototypes for the wall have been built. The military has worked with ICE to set up barricades. There has been progress, despite you not seeing it.
On the economy, the whole world is not doing great economically. France's unemployment is 9.3% and Spain's is 15.2%. Even Canada is at 5.6%. We could talk about the countries having serious problems, too, like Syria at 50%, Senegal at 48%, Yemen at 35%, Venezuela at 33%. Many African countries are around 20%. There has been world growth, but the USA's has been particularly good, especially given we were already economically strong.
As for minority groups, I don't know why you say they don't matter, but they do. Races tend to live in different areas and even have different cultures. So when the unemployment rate is lowered because a few people got jobs all around the country, that's different than when it goes lower because a city in despair finally gets jobs. Trump is bringing jobs to the neediest areas, which is why Blacks in particular are benefiting so much.
lmao
```The railway system has already gotten approval to go ahead for research by the UN, and South Korea is sending engineers and resources to study upgrading North Korea's system for the connection to South Korea``` So, the main problems with the railway are: sanctions, bad relations, NK promising to nuke everybody etc... I seriously doubt it will be built, because it also requires maintneance and u wont take that responsebility if you dont make any profit from it. What are the Nort-Koreans gona buy? Japanese body pillows and Korean vibrators? ```As for the joint Olympic bid, that's more meaningful than you make it out to be. Hosting Olympics costs a lot of money and takes a lot of organization. It also makes a lot of money in tourism. Just sitting down and making the plan means something, but also if they ever won (admittedly unlikely), that would be huge for working together and North Korea opening up.``` While I do agree that its more of a symbolical thing, I dont agree with the statement that it opens NK up. We have a perfect example of USSR for that matter. Many USSR sportsment (especially cold olympics like skiing) were Estonian. It didnt open up.
```On missile sites, blowing them up is permanent. Sure, they can rebuild or have other sites, but blowing up sites is still permanent.``` Nothing is permanent in this world. Blowing up a few sites means nothing. They did that before and built new ones. Although sites differ (which is another longer discussion). ```The reason North Korea had a rough winter btw, is because of the pressure Trump put on them. China leaned on them because of Trump.``` And no, Chinese export to NK hasnt lessened drastically. Ofcourse, it is now harder to export/import something with NK but that doesent mean its impossible. Chinese (and to some extent also Russians) use ships to export/import goods. From making oil tankers look like cargo ships to mid-sea fuel dumping (transfering oil from 1 tanker to another) they use all sorts of methods to get past the sanctions or outright cheat them.
fuck
my hand is tired
I will follow up with the second part
@Tyberius D Sure, some of it is point of view, but some of it comes down to facts as well.
On the GOP, what smart people were run out? Jeff Flake? And what do you mean by the populists can't do math?
Also, I want to be clear that I'm a left-leaning Centrist. I voted for Obama twice. I'm not on the Right at all. While I'm a nationalist because I believe in the nation-state, I stand against ethnonationalism and I believe in global trade deals, just the good kind.
On North Korea, I never said there was physical connection yet, but they are working towards that. Research, money, and resources are being put towards developing connecting the countries. That's a big deal. Also, North Korea has more tourists than you probably think. Most of them are good. Otto Warmbier was the exception, and Trump got him back, too, btw. I wouldn't be surprised if the three hostages were spies, either. We don't know what their real stories are, but I think you are being unfair to them.
The PCA was a horrible deal. Why do you think it wasn't? Like I said, the goals were completely non-legally binding. That means that if the USA were to commit and China doesn't, China would gain economic advantages and we would be punished for following it, while China isn't. That's as bad as it gets. And yes, the riots are due to the PCA, because the taxes were put on (especially gasoline) to get under the CO2 goals of the PCA. Not sure how you can say these aren't connected.
As to what you said at the end, 60 in the Senate rarely happens. It's common for a push against the President's party in the midterms. In fact, the Senate grew. Only the House went down in numbers, and by less than expected. It was actually a solid day for the Republicans.
@McBacoon Laughing only shows how insecure you are. I'll deal with your arguments later, but so far you have offered very little. Maybe stop laughing and concentrate a little more on convincing arguments.
dunno how I am supposed to make them more convincing, word them better? I might difficulties with that cuz english is not my first language
and I will laugh how much I like, and that has nothing to do with being insecure
2 capitalists debating
<:GWcentralWowDess:377110520819613696>
```It was an economic agreement that asked countries to promise to self-regulate to certain goals. It did nothing. It will only punish those who follow it, and it will benefit those who don't. (France follows and has riots.) ``` Atleast it is a stride towards something. I do not completely agree with it aswell, as I would also like it to be legally binding. But do you know how important it is for countries to have some sort of sights on what to improve. Like making 20% of electricity renewable... PCA benefitted so much that more European funding came to build more renewable electricity resources. As seen from Estonia, all of the renewable projects have european funding. Although I dont really understand by what you mean "punish those who follow it". The Yellow vest riots is France dont have much to do with PCA. The only connecting thing is that its a "green tax" that they are trying to raise, but even that is just a cover to balance the hole that was created by the rich tax. ```The military has worked with ICE to set up barricades. There has been progress, despite you not seeing it.``` I dont thing 200+ millions is worth it. Although there are some benefits of military helping, there isnt much that they can do except support (like intel and logistics).
```France's unemployment is 9.3% and Spain's is 15.2%. Even Canada is at 5.6%.``` While France is having some economic difficulties (along with S-europe) then Canada isnt doing that bad. 5.6 isnt that bad and from what I have seen, its decreasing. ```Syria at 50%, Senegal at 48%, Yemen at 35%, Venezuela at 33%.``` 3/4 are in some sort of armed conflict, and Venezuela is a self-created crisis. All of them have no affect to the world economy. Venezuela doesent even produce enough oil to shake the oil price. ```here has been world growth, but the USA's has been particularly good, especially given we were already economically strong.``` + Asia and some parts of Europe. Those are the economies that have actual affect on the world economy. And there are more nations coming as some are still recovering from 2008. ```Minority groups``` As for minority groups, I dont have much personal experience on that department as I live in a very homogenous society. But from my POV, I have no difference if I hire 20 black guys or 20 white guys to work in my factory as long as they meet the criteria. But... maybe thats a US thing... idk ```Trump is bringing jobs to the neediest areas``` How tho? I think its rather that the enterpreneurs and companies are bringing jobs....
@McBacoon About the railway, you said the main problems are sanctions, bad relations, and NK promising to nuke the world. The railway is predecated on denuclearization. It's unlikely the Koreas would be going forward with the railway as far as they have already if they didn't see a serious path towards denuclearization. Also, NK has already gotten UN approval to make the railway exempt from the sanctions. I argue that NK was striving to get nukes for security, but the best security is becoming getting rid of them and building up an interconnected economy with South Korea. Missiles are just making NK a target at this point.
NK is much more hidden than the USSR ever was. NK does allow tourists, but only in certain places. With as many tourists as the Olympics would bring, tourists would go all over the country. That's very different than the USSR situation.
Blowing up sites is permanent. Even if they blow them up and rebuild them, that still costs money. It does mean something. If you just shrug off these types of gestures as literally meaning nothing, than you are not a part of the serious discussion.
On China, you were mainly arguing against things I didn't say. Go back and read what I actually said, which is that Trump leaned on China which is what caused North Korea to have a tough winter. Of course China tries to cheat them, but we also catch some of this stuff, and we were really cracking down last year: https://www.dw.com/en/south-korea-confirms-it-has-seized-tanker-suspected-of-delivering-oil-to-north-korea/a-41972044
``` I argue that NK was striving to get nukes for security, but the best security is becoming getting rid of them and building up an interconnected economy with South Korea. Missiles are just making NK a target at this point.``` NK is a dynasty. Kim Jong-Un´s father started with the nuclear program and Kim is now fixated on the path to reach US mainland. Nukes provides security as you said, and they would be fools to give them up. NK saw what happened to Lybia, Iraq and recently Iran. As long as Kim is in power, they wont get rid of the nukes. I can bet my house on that. Missiles just add the capability to their guarantee. If you have a missile that reaches US mainland, then it has much more of an effect that a missile that cant do that. Also, NK version of "denuclearisation" is something different than what US has in mind. ```NK is much more hidden than the USSR ever was.``` In some ways, yes. But it wasnt so that you could also freely wander around as a tourist in USSR. It was also pretty controlled like in NK. ```Blowing up sites is permanent. Even if they blow them up and rebuild them, that still costs money. It does mean something.``` Wasnt the site that they blew up, the same one that they did an underground nuke experiment and collapsed? Wiki apparently backs me up. So, destroying an facility that doesent have much use anyway, doesent mean much more that just nice pics of "were improving, please lessen sanctions"