@.B a mix of both, really. I know you say it would be a waste of time, but it may be one of the few ways to reduce their influence and power

maybe for other people. In my country everyone is a socialist

for someone that is a conservative, the fight is a waste of time

they will ruin your life and you won't get anything done

the population also doesn't want anything you advocate for

Traditionally, socialists should be against the EU. They're a capitalist organization controlled by the elite, which should be everything the socialists hate. Just frame the EU this way when debating with them

Hell, I'm on the left myself and I don't like the EU

At least not in its current state

are you European?

the EU is in no way "capitalist"

most companies in my home country survive from EU money or government money

they don't even tackle the market

high taxes and regulations also means you can't compete with the big players

High taxes, regulations and social programs don't constitute socialism. That's just social democracy, which is what we have here in Canada. Private businesses are still allowed to operate independently from the government and wealth isn't redistributed

"allowed to operate independently" kinda

"wealth isn't redistributed" arguable

Canadian system is shite tbh. Small business gets fucked daily

@Beemann agreed. Our liberal and conservative parties seem to value large corporations more, one of the few things they have in common

Our social welfare systems are going to fall apart soon too tbh

Government asks more and outputs less every year

@.B It isn't redistributed to the degree that everyone has an equal amount of wealth (except the individual(s) at the top of the system)

no shit

There are higher taxes for wealthier people but that's the case in most countries

nah, if you have kids you don't have to work a day in your life

Wot

yep, that's a thing

Not in Canada lol

we were talking about Europe

not Canada

Those are nation dependent, not EU dependent

If your country is going gulag mode that's not on the EU necessarily

are you out-of-date on this?

EU is forcing welfare

while the conditions are still per-country

welfare is a real thing being pushed by the EU

Link

https://ec.europa.eu/social/main.jsp?langId=en&catId=750

https://www.politico.eu/article/welfare-discourages-work-labor-market-employment-social-rights/

The first link is EU specific, the second is just an example

the new UN bill (being pushed my mostly Europeans) also forces every country that signs it to give free education and health care to illegal migrants

The first one is recommendations. The second is pre-existing