From what I have gathered in my own time, Christmas is celebrated in the time of December due to the prevalence of "Pagan" religions celebrating the Winter Solstice. Christmas was incorporated into Christianity to introduce new converts to at least some sense of familiarity.

That being said, I don't find Christmas to be heretical as it doesn't transfer worship from God or Christ on to something material in nature.

I think I need to clarify what I was saying in regards to the Pagan point. Jesus was believed to born in spring, due to the grazing time for sheep, Christians did not start celebrating Christmas because pagans celebrated the Soltice, December 25 was selected as the "official" date to celebrate it do to a vast number of Pagan converts.

I'm not sure I understand your question. Could you clarify?

Thank you for the clarification. The matter on what the details of certain Pagans did on the Solstice is of little importance. The Church offered an opportunity for Pagans to keep a portion of there cultural inheritance as a deal for conversion, so long as those cultural celebrations did not stand as a rival to God. The sacrificual aspects are new to me. If you could point the cultures that did do that, I would be very grateful. A fair portion of Lutheran doctrine is derived from the regional, in this case German, culture. The same went for Scandinavian converts. On the Semitic part, I do not celebrate Passover. My ancestors are Germans and Celts, I have no cultural or ancestral ties to Israelites outside of faith. So long as a local cultural holiday does not Deify something that is not Good, it shouldn't be an issue, at least in my opinion.

*God* not *Good*. Silly auto correct.

@Kaladin I forgot to add something to what I had put down before. It is in regard to what you said about Christmas being about Consumerism and family instead of God and Christ. I wholeheartedly agree with you on the Consumerism aspect. The scramble for buying gifts, especially the "perfect one", has polluted the beauty that Christmas ought to be. Many would think that Christmas being about family is not to bad of a compromise for those who are not religious but still wish to celebrate it. The issue with this, is that love for family is not the rightful sovereign of the world. The love I have for my brother must never stand in the way of me doing the right thing. If he killed a man, and told me so, it would be wrong for me to hide him from the authorities.

The refraining of conducting labor on the Sabbath is not so much as " Do absolutely nothing and laze about all day". But to give Man a day to dedicate ones mind to God and not toiling in the dirt, being totally preoccupied with furthering their material possessions.

Man must,at times, toss aside the plow and dedicate time to God spiritually. What good is a man if he can't find his connection with God? It is very difficult for the blind to lead the blind.

"Unrightfully". That right there. They are like the Rabbi, and the other individuals, that passed by the man on the street that was later helped by a Samaritan. Men who call themselves"Godly" and "righteous" hate fews things more than being called out as a hypocrite. The solution? Character assassination of those who would call them out.

If a law, or as Derek put it, regulations, inhibits a truely good act, it is morally justified to break it. You follow what God, or in this case Jesus, says. What Jesus said was in his actions. It was right.

This has been a very enjoyable exchange but I must bid for the time being. Dinner awaits. Farewell.

Is that much of a surprise? Jack***es like that know s*** they say will get a reaction, so they say the most insufferably obnoxious bs imaginable.

Why on Earth did it change jackass and shit to that?

Oh. Well I feel like an idiot now.

I was erring on the side of caution and censored my profanity. Evidently the discord gods we're displeased.

Much abliged for the advice, my good sir.

I honestly don't know... When I think of which people I wish to pray for, I struggle to decide who would be at the forefront of my mind. I hear of so much barbarity in the world and I, on some occasions, feel so small. I question whether others think the same, or if I am but a single ember, in a lonely night. Whether so many things... The killing of farmers in South Africa, imprisonment of my Christian Brothers and Since who imprisoned or tortured because of there faith, the ignoring of discrimination against Catholics in China, or the Muslims in China who are imprisoned. It feels like it's to much and that if I don't remember them, no one will. I apologise if this seemed long winded. At times I grow to lazy to stop.

@Porcupioneer were there 2 comments before yours? I see " Today at 9:18" and a pencil mark, but no words.

Ok.

@Porcupioneer What was the comment above ZSLiby? I didn't come through to me.

+it didn't+

@Porcupioneer I'm sorry, i meant after mine.

It showed two after mine that weren't yours

It showed that two comments came after mine, not counting yours. I don't know if the issue is on my end or I'm explaining it horribly.

The messages could have simply come in delayed. I was in a bad connection zone.

I was just thinking about Wallace and Gromit a couple days back. The nostalgia.

That's the point though, we, as a society, have been drip fed since the time that we were old enough to reason and think, that NAZI is the Avatar of all moral evil in the world. The Death camps are more personal to Americans. Our Grandfather's and Great-grandfathers generation found them. They never saw the gulags in person.

"Stop honoring Nazi colonizers" I just read that more carefully... My brain hurts. Most of the idiots who say bs like that unironically wouldn't even know why Spain funded Columbus's voyage westward. The ramifications of the fall of Constantinople are lost on them, as well *who* conquered Constantinople and felled the Byzantine Empire, along with the motive.

Here Here.

@Hibernian Raptor-Lord You don't need to feel embarrassed. At times one can overlook a detail when they are trying to decipher something important. I've done it before. All that matters is that you realized what you overlooked.

On the part concerning the committing of a morally objectionable act, the importance of the "ignorance" would likely need to be stressed. If one was never exposed to God, such as being raised in an atheistic household, certain things can be more readily forgiveable. It was "honest" ignorance. On the other hand, if the individual was totally aware of the moral wrongness of their actions, and simply conveniently turned a blind eye to it, arguing that " how could I have known it was wrong? Some Faith's say it is good, others as you it isn't". This is dishonest ignorance. It is akin to me refraining from going to the dentist do to me fearing bad news about an aching tooth. I cannot be honest in saying" I didn't know it was an issue".

I agree. But, the level of sin can be measured, to some extent,by ones knowledge ofthe sin being a sin.

@Kit_DewStein Thank you for the link. It was very helpful.

This took me far too long to get the joke.

@Kaladin It is a One Piece reference.

Deeds, not words. If all you needed to do was lip service, it'd be pretty damned easy to be a good Christian.

Textbook definition of Out of the frying pan and into the fire.@❄֍Winter Soul֍❄

Mere Christianity, by C.S. Lewis would be a good read to explain as well.

It's from the Codex Democrates. It accounts the trials and tribulations of Saint Rosary (Rosy) Palms and her 5 sisters in the month of November.

The issue with ridding the the moral tales in religious texts( in this case Christianity) of divinity,is that it removes the "ought" from our responsibilities. What I mean by that, is that the duty of a father to fight and in some cases die for his family is rooted (in the Christian sense) is displayed in Christ(the groom) dying for his bride(the church). This "duty" of men to fight, kill, and die for others is seen as a great burden, and a greater sacrifice. And we are expected to *want* to do it as it is right. Removing the Divine aspect makes it a horrendous act on par with not only have slaves that are reared up to fight, but to condition them with being content with their lot in life.

@Nuro In regards to you asserting that "sentience" gives a right to life. Equality is a false god. A zebra is prey. Just as much as a lion is a predator. We humans live by breeding and killing millions of animals. This can be justified by "Society flourishes because of it". If sentience gives the right to life, my rights would take greater precedence than the rights of a mental invalid. With that Central belief, you get an ethic that justifies, even celebrates, the killing of those who society, or more likely politicians, deems a drain. If the value is placed upon protecting kin, you may in turn create a racialist ethic that puts the lives of family and one's "People" over the well-being of non-kin. I apologise for this rather long-winded message, I simply wished to share why I am very guarded when people state that one can be a "good" person without religion. Subjectivism has always got my hackles raised.

The Pharasees were far too content with Rome giving them a very loose leash in regards to the Jews in Judea. Jesus was an obstacle to them as he called out their bs. So they killed him.@CoolGuard

Thanks. Much appreciated.

Thu most hafian losod thin witt.

I've listened to works by C.S. Lewis. They helped me when I going through a rough time.

@bagel03 I just saw your profile pic. Huzzah! A man of culture.

They "killed themselves" from overuse. Really "stretching" it to it's breaking point.

If he was wanting to discuss making Colonel Sanders a Saint, or giving KFC tax exemptions like churches, I'd probably be open to talking about it out of the sheer hilarity of the idea.

If the slogan "Black lives matter" was something these idiots actually belived in, they'd be crusading against drive-by shootings that kill innocent kids in the inner city. More black people are killed by other black people in Chicago than how many are unarmed and killed by the police. This is all about them absolving themselves of some self-imposed sense guilt. And they hold all who resemble them aesthetically just as guilty.

It was likely shrooms, to be fair. Methamphetamines weren't made until the 20th century I believe.

Or a brain tumor perhaps.

Thinking is not a strong suit of these people.

Evil is the absence of God.

I see parallels between the Creation story and real life. As children, we have no concept of financial responsibility or real world issues that we need burden ourselves with. As adults, we are plagued with the sacrificing of much of our laboring simply to survive. The upside of being adults? We know more. The downside? We're burdened with it.

Something I agree with completely. Gone are the days where I need not burden myself, and simply play and delight in living. No concern to be had.

If I were offered, at the moment of my birth, whether I would stay in heaven or go down to Earth, knowing what I knew now, knowing of all hateful things I would see in the world, all the hate that would fill me, consume me, and all the anguish and heartache I would feel even with less than a quarter of a century on this Earth? I would still say send me. If there is but one good thing I can do to make this world a better place, send me and send me NOW. Christ wept at the grave of Lazarus. He was betrayed by a friend. John the Baptist, Peter, and Paul, and untold others died horrible deaths for God. They knew what would happen if they kept the faith. If they can go through that, I say "Why not I"?

All the love he has for us is not out of us deserving it. I struggled with this for a long time. "I must have some worthiness of being loved. It can't be I was created to be loved. That puts it in God's court. I must some inborn brightness that doesn't come from God." He created us to be loved. It's biologically inclined (like loving ones children or ones lover), it simply *is*.

It's *not* biologically inclined.

@Zallis The Pokemon A bit late to your comment, I was busy. On blaming others for the sins of the past,... *Here is a hypothetical* My Father comes home affected by the war he was in. To deal with what he sees, he drinks and beats me and my siblings. As a consequence, I see this as an appropriate means of disciplining ones children. I do this to my own children. My son flees from me and due to him being starved of affection, begins drinking and doing drugs. He overdoses. Who is more responsible for the latest generations failure? Themselves? Their parents? There grandparents? Every generation partook in the chain of sin. It does not matter who started it. You chose to become another link in the chain and are to be damned alongside the others. Only through breaking the chain can you be free. It is a useless endeavor to trace the lineage of the origins of the chain to render blaim on someone. It will always, without fail, trace back to the Fall of Man. The first time Man defied God.

@DeButcher I know he wasn't. I was just commenting on how some people would try to excuse their own bad behavior by saying someone else is responsible.

And each generation would sic the responsibility onto someone else until they run out scapegoats.

TLDR. Yeah, pretty much.

Putting our own desires before God is idolatrous. We put ourselves in the position of the golden calf.

And we all know what happened to the calf, in the end.

Hahaha. Did not expect that. Thanks for the laugh.

@Zallis The Pokemon You're right, I just wished to offer my 2 cents to the conversation.

@Texas Crusader Deus Vult, brother. Rip and Tear until is done.

DIE GREENSKIN!!!!!! YYYUUUMMMM!!!!!!!

I'm not sure how to respond to this.

Oh $h1t, that sounds bad. I'm unfortunately not familiar with the switch, as I don't have one. I'm not sure where you can go to see about fixing it.@Texas Crusader

Constant prayer to make it work? I don't know.

Oh heavenly father, show mercy on this contemptable soul, and breathe new life into this gaming console... Amen.

I could only assume that she perhaps thinks this is a far less toxic section of Discord in relation to other parts concerning masks.

*Shocked gasp* Really? I wouldn't have guessed there were many Christians here... Great Scott!!!!!

An example of nuts would be Aztec religion involving ritualistic cannibalism in human sacrifice.

Been there, not done that.@Dstar_Destroyer

Debates can get very toxic. Just 2 nights ago I got called a racist.