It’s almost as if the problem is governments trying to force a certain vision on people rather than allowing people to determine for themselves how to integrate themselves into society

@Bleach Use the last vestiges of your logic to think about what you’re saying

The Rothchild’s? If you’re going to go all conspiracy theorist, at least be original

So what “makes you human” then? If you’re going to make such a bold statement as that, you must have something very specific in mind that the 21st century world is missing

I’m suspicious of anyone who thinks “primitive” is good. I mean, I for one like the fact that industrial society means I’m less likely to die of an infectious disese now than at any time in the past

can anyone think of any country that has weakened its connections to global trade and prospered? There are plenty of examples of the opposite

@The Monkey Sounds like something that only someone with access to vaccines would say

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design." -Friedrich Hayek

Always a bigger fish

@bobbie225 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kek_(mythology)

@luke5135 “if our lawmakers were better educated on the laws they're making”

I mean, that applies to anything

I’ve found that most white supremecists have never really accomplished much in their lives. Since they don’t have any accomplishments to take pride in, they look for instrinsic qualities to boost their self-worth. Race is an obvious one that they latch on to.

@Stresbal that’s the other side of that same coin lol

It’s interesting that white supremecists are often so worried about some hypothetical “white genocide,” while simultaneously believing that somehow white people are better than everyone else. If you’re actually so much better, why worry about dying out? It’s contradictory

I’d advocate for people to do whatever the hell they want because it’s none of my business

@!GoldenKingship! And still, why is that any of your concern? Why are you so worried about who someone else is having kids with?

Well, since I’m not Catholic, corporatist, pan-German, nationalist, or anti-Semitic, I’m going to say no, it was not good

@JesusHand I don’t like people near enough to be pansexual

So is discrimination

Ok then, prove your point. Prove that that’s harmful to anyone

https://scholar.princeton.edu/sites/default/files/emonk/files/monk_-_the_cost_of_color_-_ajs.pdf

Here’s a peer-reviewed study that traces the origin of negative health effects among minorities to percieved discrimination as a stressor

Which would seem to suggest that any negative health trends among mixed race individuals are likely the result of, you know, opposition to their existence by racists such as can be seen in this chat

In other words, if you’re opposed to “race mixing,” you’re the problem

@!GoldenKingship! Interesting data points. The article I posted offers a framework for interpreting those data points in a way that ultimately explains those correlations (since, as we all know, correlation is not causation) as the result of stress from racism and real or perceived discrimination. So, no, not checkmate, at all

I can’t really comment on point 1, as that study’s not been done yet. But there is racism against Asian-Americans, so it would be reasonable to apply the same to that population as well.

Your second point is basically, “people in the past lived in tribes, so we should too.” Why? Just because people in the past fought each other because of some imagined community, why should we, in the 21st century, feel any need to do the same.

I actually have to applaud you for being honest about the real root of your views on this. You say that people in the past were “wary” of people from a different group. I understand now- you’re afraid of people who look different. That’s a difficult impulse to overcome, and you have my sympathy. But your fears shouldn’t drive public policy

http://sitn.hms.harvard.edu/flash/2017/science-genetics-reshaping-race-debate-21st-century/

Didn’t he just practice the traditional Arabic polytheism prior to Islam?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_pre-Islamic_Arabia

This is Wikipedia, but you can mine it for more reliable sources

@Pelth Well, I’m inclined to believe a Ph.D. Candidate’s research before the insistence of some random guy on Discord

Firstly, ad hominem attacks aren’t an argument. Secondly, how do you define race if not based on genetic similarities?

@👑 Fascism ✝heocratic That’s some impressive word salad

Ok? That’s all true information lol

We share over 99% with each other, what’s your point?

I mean, you share more DNA with your close relatives than someone not related to you, again, what’s the point?

Lol ok

On a related note, have you ever heard of the Dunning-Kruger effect?

You clearly know a little bit about genetics, which is leading you to be far more confident in your knowledge than is warranted

And yet the data shows that those divisions are far more blurred than is generally perceived

I don’t think you realize how much you’re imposing your interpretations into this. DNA is just a thing that exists, but you’re putting your own assumptions about how different genes should be grouped and categorized into it to make that framework happen

Humans have a tendency to impose an ordered understanding onto naturally occurring chaos

I find it interesting that you cite genetic similarity as the basis for race while discounting research that shows a lack of similarity. What’s really dishonest?

Ok? Once again, that’s data, but you’re also imposing your paradigms onto it

Ok, let me ask you a hypothetical question

Let’s imagine two couples. One couple is blonde haired, blue eyed, European, total Nazi’s dream couple. The other is from central Africa, dark skinned, as African as African can be. By your definition of race, they’re different races, correct?

Now, both women become pregnant by their respective man. But, suddenly, out of nowehere, gamma rays from space hit both newly formed embryos, altering their DNAs. In a totally unlikely and basically impossible in real life scenario, their DNA mutates in such as way that both babies now have identical genetic codes. The two children are now, for all genetic purposes, identical twins. Are they the same race?

That’s a very interesting answer, because I don’t think most people would agree with you on that. Whatever that’s worth

I feel like most would throw something about culture or heritage or geographic location in, which further cements the idea that race is an imagined community sort of thing

Still, your framework for understand race requires you to sort and categorize data into fairly arbitrary categories based on small similarities, so it’s still interpretive on your part

I agree that race and culture are different. Race is arbitrary categorization while culture is about collective creativity

Why are you positive of that?

You know what they say: only fools are positive, geniuses hesitate

Lol

You could just as easily argue that culture forms in response to historical and geographic context.

Europeans are as well

I mean, look at all the social programs European governments have designed

The problem with all of this, though, is why Asians, or Africans, or Europeans would lose that sense of collectivism when they move to America, which is exactly what has happened throughout history. America is far more individualist, so if collectivism has a genetic basis, why wouldn’t we see that in the US?

That’s purely speculation

Could be, but without evidence there’s no way of arguing that

You know, conservative men joke a lot about “triggered SJWs,” but as a group they are so easy to trigger. All you have to do is imply that no one wants to sleep with them, and they’re off

Maybe this is irrational, but I’ve never believed that Rush Limbaugh actually buys into his own rhetoric. He’s friends off the air with several far-left types, and has a much different persona when he’s not broadcasting, based on some things I’ve seen with him.

All that said, it’s still bad that he spouts the stuff he spouts, but the real problem lies in the fact that there’s a market for that craziness. His followers are more a problem than he is

Honestly, I used to think that about Jones too, but I think he might actually be that unhinged. That guy needs medication

You’re right on Hannity though lol

@Deleted User That’s fair. I guess I’m just trying to get into their heads, to understand how people could possibly think the way they think

The 24 hour news cycle is what ruined the news

In the past, when the news was 15-30 minutes in the evening, they were much more selective and tried to just report the facts. Today, they have to fill time, and they fill it with crap debate shows that gravitate towards the most extreme ideologies

Basically every economist out there is criticizing Trump’s trade policies. It’s one of the few things economists have a consensus on

Tariffs will stifle economic growth and USMCA is just NAFTA with a different name.

But the shills can now say, “he kept his promise to get ride of NAFTA”

@Deleted User I mean, he provided quotes from Trump himself that it was all good, how much more do you expect lol

@Vlad He does refuse to listen to experts. He’s basically ignoring the entire field of economics

@Vlad Yes! That is very interesting stuff. I’ve read some similar stuff on that with how the right and left interpret morality

@Vlad this is what I was reading about

https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Haidt-political_morality.png#mw-jump-to-license

Basically that the right and left weigh different moral dimensions differently

Evangelicals vote for whoever has the R next to their name

I really can’t imagine Jesus being cool with Trump

Every evangelical I’ve talked to about this has responded with, “well, the other choice was Clinton, so...” and then they trail off. Like, that’s not supposed to be how any of this works

@Deleted User That’s a very good point, I didn’t think of that

So, evangelicals in the past that may have voted for Clinton are no longer self-identifying as evangelicals

I don’t have a source but I remember reading once that the more fringe sects are growing as the more mainline sects decline. That coincides with people leaving religion altogether, so the net is still a decline

No idea if that’s still accurate though

Right, people are either leaving religion, or gravitating to one more rooted in experience (like the charismatics and Pentecostals)

I’ve been listening to boomer music lol

I found a playlist of Vietnam era protest songs and kind of spun off from there with all sorts of oldies

I’ve been listening to Jim Croce a lot

Yes, definitely

Look, sat what you will about boomers, it’s all deserved, but damn they knew how to write music

That is a very good song for the current times

Lol

That is my favorite

Where are you from?

Nice

Speaking of oil, how about that petrodollar? It’s almost like the push for the US to go to war with Iran is rooted in the fact that Iran is trying to set up an exchange to trade oil in currencies other than dollars

The petrodollar isn’t about getting oil, it’s about global demand for the US dollar and US bond rates

And that’s tied up in the oil market

Yes, but all international oil trade is done with dollars, with drives up demand for dollars and allows the US to sell bonds at a higher rates