Message from @Koninos
Discord ID: 686318323180372060
I used to be big in the Stoicism scene teeheehee... I've read pretty much all of Marcus Aurelius and Epictetus (not that there is much of their writing to begin with). I think people too often conflate a robotic, unfeeling nature with the logical consequences of Stoicism. Marcus Aurelius and Epictetus stress that the universe follows an intelligible plan and design, and that the logos (or reasonable soul) conferred on humanity allows us to transcend the mundane suffering of the body by having us perceive this intelligibility that the universe abides by (and Marcus would tell us, in pantheistic fashion, that the universe IS God). Because we partake in divinity through the logos, and the divine is eternal and cannot be harmed, then to use reason - which is not dependent on the material - is to partake in a joy which can never be deprived. I think this is a beautiful concept but I don't like the fatalistic interpretations associated with it. Recognition of the divine plan doesn't mean we should be non-actors.... I think to stand by and not apply the body, the vehicle of our logos, into the world of the material is like hedonism - sad and boring. No fatalism for me sir
But yeah "anti-fragility" (modern Stoicism movement?) politics is totally spot on in my mind and is why I am close to a free-speech absolutist
@Ater Votum based
To be honest, I don't really like the way that many Stoic philosophers connect Stoicism with the Divine, although such connection is very well justified. The reason why I am a Stoic myself is because of the benefits that come with it, in real life, and even in the modern world, which is a world of image and fragility. And I also believe that Stoicism should be involved with parenting, especially in the modern times, due to what a jungle the modern world is. It is important for the child to be tough, and to realize that in order to survive out there, it needs to go through pain, not avoid it, but see it as a challenge. One of the many goals of humanity is to achieve eternal happiness, which may never be achieved, but through Stoicism, fragility and unhappiness are eradicated completely.
And yet there are some uneducated, irrational individuals, who claim that Stoicism is a synonym for masochism, and that it should be avoided.
That is simply disgraceful.
When your affirmation for life is contingent on materials outside your body (such as wealth, attention, or drugs), then if you are deprived of that material then you can no longer affirm life
> If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.
-Marcus Aurelius.
The one who affirms their life through being virtuous can never be willingly deprived of their joy.
Based.
You shouldn't keep emotions under wraps
bottling up emotions is one of the worse things you can do
stoicism isnt about "bottling up emotions" lmao
^
that is exactly what it is, hiding your emotions
Stoicism is about facing and enduring pain.
Which is unhealthy
How?
everyone deals with pain differently
Obviously.
maybe in your case
Kinda right not everyone does
Stoicism might seem unhealthy at an X moment, but when in a Y moment, you face pain again, you're stronger, you can face the pain more easily and not let it affect you, so in the long-term, it's healthy. @moira
Not exactly
everyone deals with pain differently
some people deal with it better by talking to people
some people deal with it better by shutting themselves in
it really depends on the person
if you can hide your emotions and pain then good for you
but not everyone is like you
Yeah okay, nobody's saying that everyone should be a Stoic.
But Stoicism should be involved with parenting, since the child is taught how to deal with pain.
you literally promoted it for parenting
Yes.
when dealing with pain in a child, it is best to sit them down and talk with them about it
now of course they shouldn't be a crybaby
but you can't just tell them to lock it all up
Children, when they are young, don't know how to control their emotions. Stoicism, in my opinion, is the best way to control your emotions, because of how it can help you in the long-term.
Stoicism isn't about bottling emotions.
It's about facing them.