That's a real real shame. I'm sorry to hear that. Surely in the city they would be open to you having a pony tail, at least? I thought cities were less sexist about this stuff. :/

@Tiggy I don't know. It seemed like a bad time to find out.

continued from <#512584678314606613>

@Bobby_Hill and one could be Hitler, but that's not really relevant, is it?

honestly, the issue is a little too grey for my tastes...

you have serious medical situations, where the fetus is literally killing the mother, thats clear cut

but you have other situations like... low income single mother that doesn't know who the father is

or a wife that doesn't want to have to deal with children getting secret abortions while her husband thinks they are 'trying'

when its non-medical its a very grey issue

some situations are almost abuse to the fathers... from my perspective

or situations are probably for the best

its just such an ocean of situations

when it is a personal choice... its really just case by case basis on whether it seems 'right'

but I feel like barring fathers from any say in the matter is an injustice

You shouldn't be forced to be financially responsible for a child, I apply this to both genders. I support abortion in general, not extreme cases like late term, because of the strain pregnancy puts on a woman's body and mind and a foetus does not have consciousness or sentience.

but I couldn't tell you how much of a say they should have

A foetus is an object, it is not a person. Should I not throw away an old computer because AI could one day develop?

this feels like a different issue

Ai probably wouldn't care about where it's hosted

thats a question of abortion as a whole

This is more like.... cutting your nails

I'm just talking about whether fathers have a right for a voice in the abortion decision

Something that is both human and alive

does your lab partner have a right to influence your choice of your away that computer?

I think the difficult part of the issue is that I don't want someone to force someone else to carry a child

you worked on the program together

The discussion in <#512584678314606613> turned to abortion as a whole, since it was mentioned someone who had 20 abortions should be on trial for murder and was agreed with

its your computer but its their work as well that went into it

But I also don't want father to have no say

the fetus isnt an object you stupid fucker

I disagree with abortion being murder because that makes miscarriages manslaughter

its alive and shows breain activity at 2 months

And a woman who just lost a baby she wanted shouldn't have to go to jail on top of that

ah, I see what you mean InsaneCaterpilla

Before birth, the father paid a minimal part in the creation of the child, being honest. And I'm absolutely not of the opinion that fathers are unimportant in a child's upbringing. It's not been a totally collaberative process, so your comparison is inaccurate. The potential father does not bare the strains of body and mind, the woman does, and if she chooses not to accept this burden she shouldn't have to

I agree with that

I think... I think what I would want the most is that if the father wanted the baby to be aborted and the mother decides to keep it, he can't be asked to pay child support

i think thats fair

definately @Avistew

I don't disagree with your points, I'm just sad that a quirk of biology gives a woman so much power in the decision to have a child

Yeah

why should the only out for a father be suicide