That's so true. Also mental health professionals mostly females, it's tough for them to understand the male psyche unless they are really experienced in their respective fields. We need more male psychologists. I think that's the key reason as to why men open up about their problems with their buddies rather than opting for professional help. They are often skeptic about the level of empathy that they won't have with the professionals.

@lazzzycarrot(30) / senpai(40) You can also look at the behavior of suicide survivors. While the risk of actually comitting suicide is greatly increased for those who have attempted in the past couple years, the numbers of those that actually do so remains low, below 5% IIRC

It's like 10% of people at some point in their lives decide life isn't worth living and act on it. 1% actually commit suicide, and some smaller number (0.1%?) legitimately hate life with a passion

except for the middle number, I haven't rigoursly confirmed the percentages

@John Wick And completely agreed with that

@asparkofpyrokravte do you mind if I go back to a statistic you said earlier, you mentioned that women attempt suicide 1.2 times more often than men I believe? How come some studies put that at 3x the rate and where does the discrpency come from?

As I noted at the time, ER reports

https://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/9qt24c/if_you_were_going_to_make_a_trifold_poster_board/e8d64br/?context=3

Some guy claimed that women actually don't attempt suicide more than men

I thought that was worth looking into

And I found that he was full of shit

But that what I thought was true (the 2x figure) was also false

Hrm, that reddit thread isn't as helpful as I thought it'd be

But anyways, that survey doesn't really have any potential flaws in its methodology, whereas the other ones that I found seemed more prone to double counting or self selection (very present with ER stuff, which selects for women who survive rather than men who don't).

How are the other studies getting the 2/3x figure though? Like, what flawed methodology are they using?

Ah, okay. I'll go dig it up, but the summary was that they were counting people at the hospital. So you get your failed poisonings, but not people who jump from 8 stories

I don't know if I am using the right words here but I do feel women generally are more pampered than men. Right from their childhood, everything seems a bar down for them when a guys' life seems to toughen up with every passing day, with more responsibility, more challenges and on a general basis less emotional support. And, this princess complex leads to emotional fragility on the other side, where with the chances of suicidal thoughts on facing a tough situation increases. Not generalising the fact, as exceptions always exist, but this is what I have observed. And I feel this contributes to the stat.

I can't remember which study it was I read, but I remember that female babies/children are more likely to be comforted when they're in distress than males are

I am not sure about that actually. Babies are equally vulnerable to diseases as their immune system is weak. Gender doesn't seem to be an issue here.

As a young child, I particularly remember being told by my father to stop crying when I got hurt, or he would 'give me something to cry about'

Same

I really need to go to sleep but I related that line so much

@lazzzycarrot(30) / senpai(40) :<

My family never said anything related to not crying. But whenever I cried publicly, I faced mocking rather than empathy. Somewhere down in the sub-conscious mind, I taught myself to not show emotions publicly.

Or If i cried as a child my mother told me to “man-up men don’t cry “

I'm not saying I never cry, but if I do I do it silently now, more akin to weeping

@InsaneCaterpilla https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss6304a1.htm#tab27

There is a 2x figure

that is based on a survey

but it is only students

So it is quite possible I'm wrong on this

Here is a 2x ER study: Ghttps://bmcpsychiatry.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12888-015-0392-2

Oof, so many tables

So you're saying the flawed methodology in the first one is that it only applies to students, where females perhaps fair less well against the stresses of education, and are also overrepresented in education, and the second one is flawed by not taking into account anyone who hasn't been referred through a hospital for mental evaluation

Which study gave the 1.2x figure?

Yeah, the most common woozle for the 3x figure found here:https://save.org/about-suicide/suicide-facts/ appears to be from the CDC document here: https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/pdf/suicide-datasheet-a.pdf, which shows closer to 2x for students, 3x was only for suicide attempts resulting in injury. Another cited one is here: https://www.semanticscholar.org/paper/The-depressed-patient-and-suicidal-patient-in-the-Chang-Gitlin/25c937bfe845f9f133d794b5f2c917df114ecf67

Whereas 1.2 comes from here https://afsp.org/about-suicide/suicide-statistics/

I remember finding the actual data from 2016 National Survey of Drug Use and Mental Health was difficult

because it is in this document: https://www.samhsa.gov/data/sites/default/files/NSDUH-DetTabs-2016/NSDUH-DetTabs-2016.pdf

which is thousands of pages...you can find it on page 2704

I'd like to share what is probably a very unpopular opinion toward reducing suicide, which is legalizing euthanasia. Not only would it allow people who live with severe pain to end their life, but it would bring into light more discussion on the topic of death. People would always know that it is an option for them, so they will be more open with themselves and others about it. I believe impulsive suicides would drop as a result.