Perhaps we need simply newer and more radical ideas that can achieve what people want without the pitfalls of what has previously been theorized.

It's far from perfect, but it is necessary for me.

@Seven Of Swords , Pleasure is not just about sexual arousal pleasure tho. you could get pleasure from eating ice cream too

Perhaps the idea that things are necessary is yet another pitfall.

@ZODD But what about ice cream headaches?

i don't get those...

Well I do...

Air is necessary. You need that to breath. Would you rather stop breathing and drop dead?

They hurt like hell, but ice cream tastes very good

Exactly.

air's not a pleasure it's more innate

Clean air is a pleasure

@Iheanacho Just because you can die, it doesn't follow that it is necessary that you must live...

You really don't have to breath air...

As long as there is way for it to be possible that necessary circumstances can be different, its not the case that they are necessary.

And see, that is my problem with neutral nihilism. Too questionable and trivial. Progressive route is more focused. People there got their shite together and just stick to it.

Is it that they have their shit together, or just put up the illusion that they do?

One has to control all of these trivialities and focused mind.

How does that happen?

Through progression. Bite the bullet and take measures to benefit your own future. Oxygen is too obvious. Don't neglect it if you wish to live. I still want to live as I want to achieve my goals and maintain them.

Collect thoughts, define goals, and pursue them. Everything else shall resolve itself upon that path.

What if you prefer not to live, yet you don't want to die either?

The ol' classic trivial mind fuck.

To me, it sounds like you've been listening to too much Jordan Peterson lmao

I dislike Jordan Peterson.

Then why support is self-help nonsense about attempting to build a foundation for goals based upon nothing?

I am more of a trial-and-error person. self-educate, and improvise.

That approach may seem intuitive, yet is riddled with paradox.

i listened to jordan peterson , but because he is not of my generation, i cannot see what he sees, i love it when he makes people look stupid on youtube tho.

You guys should check out his talk with Philosopher David Benatar.

Benatar is an anti-natalist, and Peterson gets destroyed imo

@Seven Of Swords , your approach may be paradoxical , but your suffering is how you live. you can either improve it, or stick with whatchu got.

Have you heard of Samsara?

@Seven Of Swords Why not build from nothing? If everyone thought the same way, humanity would be extinct.

If I thought the way you did, I probably would have committed suicide a long time ago. That is why nihilism needs to be controlled to avoid drifting apart into the Void.

that could be a spicy meme right there

I'm not convinced that suicide is worth more than living. And on the flip side, I'm not convinced that living is worth more than committing suicide.

If any of you guys in chat rn need to be meme approved let me know

@Iheanacho How the hell can you build from nothing?

make a meme of that

Ditto.

@Seven Of Swords he's stating your nothing, so you can only go up from where you are now.