in polls

@TheRandomist That is treasonous

It’s not a logic that will jive with most of the country

https://i.imgur.com/hXzQEF7.png

Just 20% or so hardcore remainers

Depends on the leader but I think labour in future will just try and campaign for a “better post brexit future for the many”

granted, 3 polls wont mean anything in 5 years time at the next election, but the second boris bounce is impressive

After 20 years out politics will have normalised

Yes, though they've been vocally pro further EU integration and for giving up our special conditions since before there was any talk of the referendum @Hopix , surprisingly we're able to have civil conversations about politics usually, though we have to agree to disagree on Brexit because we know neither of us is budging towards the other at all.

https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1222280472132308993

Remainers don't care about the country, or it's people

That's what you need to come to terms with

This article is why @Kunarian and similar's position on welfare are untennable in the real world

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/jan/28/disabled-man-starved-to-death-after-dwp-stopped-his-benefits

Stories like this seem to be getting more and more frequent

It chimes with my experience of the DWP

And is why i'm against the obsession with means-testing and taking people's support away

ANd why I want something more akin to universal basic welfare

The problem is that they want to ensure that no one is receiving welfare who doesn't need it, But the policy they use to find out is far too strict

The main problem is just cost

Welfare already costs a lot

extending a basic level of welfare to everyone would cost a lot more

Wherenever you have to make a decision on that, there will be people who are fucked over by that decision

Which is why you -must- remove the decision

To be fair to the DWP in this case the person did not attend multiple DWP fit-for-work tests which especially in our current welfare system we can't really allow due to the abuse of the system that it would lead to

Lol I dunno how you think that is my position on welfare @Eccles

Also I still find it funny that people want to remove decisions but then pay people like this peanuts

The problem in these cases is not that they're being paid peanuts, it's that they're having those peanuts removd

We should have some kind of UBI system

Yup

Then these stories would evaporate

Because while we can't have people claiming benefits that they are not entitled to we also can't have a system that just completely cuts off people's sole sources of income

I seem to recall you objecting to UBI on the grounds of the lack of means and entitlement testing, Kunarian

THough I confess, I might be confusing you with someone else on account of being old and forgetful

UBI is wrong

largely because it cannot actually be funded

and also the fact that it takes from the poorest

to spread amongst those who don't need it

it also doesn't target need

single people should not be entitled to the same amount as a family

and the disabled need more than those who aren't disabled