Message from @meratrix
Discord ID: 540622659608772648
and me questioning this
it is that simple
it is not whataboutism
Your asserting something as well. That materialism will suddenly care about something unobservable, and falls fully under spiritualism. Which is contrary to what materialism is at its core. Without that care tech will never develop. Ergo, your assertions are far more grandios than mine, and falls fully under whataboutism fallacies.
how can you know it is unobservable?
you claim there is a dichotomy between spiritualism and materialism, I dismiss this as there is no evidence for it, and posit instead there is knowledge and there is ignorance
you claim something can never be observed, I say I am doubtful
I think you're also just flinging out wordsalad at this point
Science has already said somethings cannot be observed. Like moments before the big bang because things like physics break down.
Your dichotomy of ignorance and knowledge is also flawed, because ignorance is seen as a negative. I wouldnt call it a dichotomy of spiritualism and materialism. But more of a symbiosis. The dichotomy would be "knowledge" (formed of both materialist and spiritualist) and ignorance
there is you claiming that something is forever unobservable, I'm saying that is nonsense. People thought gravitational waves were unobservable, that they might not exist, we developed a way to observe them.
So because i disagree with you, its wordsalad?
Via mathimatics....i doubt mathimatics will aid in this
scientists, with their current knowledge, have said they do not know how to observe something before the big bang
that is not the same as saying "we will never know"
The key i was pointing is that it would take a massive shift of thinking. Gravity was observable, and so materialists delved into it. Post death would start with unobservable. Which is antimaterialist
how is this so hard to fathom?
again with the tired materialist spiritualist nonsense, I think we're done here
The reason we cannot observe before the big bang is not necessarily because physics "breaks down", it's because the way we observe the early universe is through light, and that means that we can only observe from the big bang forward because all possible matter and/or energy was in a singularity.
Actually most of that is visual of the early universe then shifted into physics algyrithyms. It "breaks down" at the point of singularity.
Similar to gravity on the quantum
It doesn't break down. It's just that anything that would have existed before that, including light, would have become part of that singularity again, meaning it no longer has meaning to us in any recognizable way, it's just a big jumble.
And actually i misspoke it isnt the singularity itself. Our ability stops milliseconds after the "big bang"
Hence why we dont know the cause
Say for example, the theory about the Great Crunch is true. Well, if that is true than there was a universe before ours, and it eventually collapsed on itself. We can't observe this previous universe through light because it all collapsed into a singularity. Thus anything that maybe we could have observed would have also been crushed into that singularity and become unrecognizable.
But thats a guess. And one of many tbh, especially if you enter into multiverse theory
yes of course, it could for example be that we are the first and only ever universe. And that the great rip theory could be true Or the great freeze.
The multi bang theory not the crunch
Isnt there also a versiom of the multidimensional theory that explains the universe creation?
But what I'm getting at is that the reason we cannot observe anything before the big bang is because to us, essentially nothing existed before it. Anything that may have would have been made just into a jumble by being crushed into a singularity.
Its milliseconds after is the limit
Not even the singularity itself
yes, I know. I'm going through my point with multiple examples.
But again. This became a perview of the spiritualists as well, as another theory. And tbh until we can know, if ever, it isnt any less valid technically. Because until observable, we never know.
And that sates the common man. It doesnt discredit scientists who explore it, it simply lets the common man focus on other aspects of life.
Because without those who simply ascribe things to the unknown or spiritual, products wouldnt be produced to allow scientists the free time to focus on such things that really have little to do with day to day life.
Anywho, good discussion Mera. I have to go get ready for my day to day aspects of life.
👌 I gotta go explain to someone on reddit that being an immigrant is not mutually exclusive to being a snob. lol
Lol have fun with that. Thats a mutual exclusiveness i have never heard before lol.
<:pepe_why:378719408367075333> MFW the comments keeps getting downvoted because people assume by saying this I just really hate immigrants.
downvotes don't matter
plenty of immigrants are snobs