your point did not address my criticism of your notion that some things cannot be observed

how is it whataboutism?!

science does not claim to know everything at this instant

religion often does

Your assuming the future will change where material will care.

Actually a good part of religion is that no one has all the answers

why should I not assume the future will change?

science brings progress, it is ludicrous to assume stagnation

Why should you assume something that massive would?

Its not stagnation.

Its a core principle about materialism

you say something will never happen, I say it might

It all boils to whataboutism

where does your certainty stem from?

Until the pendulum moves

it boils down to you asserting something without evidence

and me questioning this

it is that simple

it is not whataboutism

Your asserting something as well. That materialism will suddenly care about something unobservable, and falls fully under spiritualism. Which is contrary to what materialism is at its core. Without that care tech will never develop. Ergo, your assertions are far more grandios than mine, and falls fully under whataboutism fallacies.

how can you know it is unobservable?

you claim there is a dichotomy between spiritualism and materialism, I dismiss this as there is no evidence for it, and posit instead there is knowledge and there is ignorance

you claim something can never be observed, I say I am doubtful

I think you're also just flinging out wordsalad at this point

Science has already said somethings cannot be observed. Like moments before the big bang because things like physics break down.

Your dichotomy of ignorance and knowledge is also flawed, because ignorance is seen as a negative. I wouldnt call it a dichotomy of spiritualism and materialism. But more of a symbiosis. The dichotomy would be "knowledge" (formed of both materialist and spiritualist) and ignorance

there is you claiming that something is forever unobservable, I'm saying that is nonsense. People thought gravitational waves were unobservable, that they might not exist, we developed a way to observe them.

So because i disagree with you, its wordsalad?

Via mathimatics....i doubt mathimatics will aid in this

scientists, with their current knowledge, have said they do not know how to observe something before the big bang

that is not the same as saying "we will never know"

The key i was pointing is that it would take a massive shift of thinking. Gravity was observable, and so materialists delved into it. Post death would start with unobservable. Which is antimaterialist

how is this so hard to fathom?

again with the tired materialist spiritualist nonsense, I think we're done here

The reason we cannot observe before the big bang is not necessarily because physics "breaks down", it's because the way we observe the early universe is through light, and that means that we can only observe from the big bang forward because all possible matter and/or energy was in a singularity.

Actually most of that is visual of the early universe then shifted into physics algyrithyms. It "breaks down" at the point of singularity.

Similar to gravity on the quantum

It doesn't break down. It's just that anything that would have existed before that, including light, would have become part of that singularity again, meaning it no longer has meaning to us in any recognizable way, it's just a big jumble.

And actually i misspoke it isnt the singularity itself. Our ability stops milliseconds after the "big bang"

Hence why we dont know the cause

Say for example, the theory about the Great Crunch is true. Well, if that is true than there was a universe before ours, and it eventually collapsed on itself. We can't observe this previous universe through light because it all collapsed into a singularity. Thus anything that maybe we could have observed would have also been crushed into that singularity and become unrecognizable.

But thats a guess. And one of many tbh, especially if you enter into multiverse theory

yes of course, it could for example be that we are the first and only ever universe. And that the great rip theory could be true Or the great freeze.