there is not much you can do

well I'm interested in engaging in the conversation about it but I felt really weird about the way he structured his arguments

I haven't watched the video, but I do think that religion plays/played a big part in the formation of morality

so you have nothing against religion, you are just troubled by the quality of his arguments?

I have nothing against religion, but I also don't think it's fair to say that atheism is immoral because you need religion in order to have morality

There is truth to that

but there have also been 2000 years of Abrahamic religion shaping thought in the West

Not saying that religion is 100%, but it certainly is a good chunk

Ok but even accepting that fact, I can easily come up for a logical way for an objective morality to come about without the involvement of religion

There have been 5000 years of Abrahamic religion

okay 5000 years

sorry

should have said Christian 😛

i think religion played as an important role as farming did

10000 years

farming? never heard that one

now you have

i just broke your conditioning

Ok, so how farming?

if we were hunter gathers i think we would have different religion.

ya know food

at least that's my hypothesis

when an excess of food became avalible (farming) the oppertunity to persue other goals became present

well I guess I can see it.

religion in my mind is a product of civilization

if youre living with a few others, in a tight knit group, there isn't a need for ritual or belief to keep the cohesion

Farming means relying on each other for food > We must rely on each other to survive > Logically must come up with a morality that fosters group survival

The larger the group, the more you need a common factor to keep everyone in line

religion is a product of conecpts that cannot yet be ........rationalized..........explained.......understoood........sharable.......

But even nomadic tribes had large groups

i should ask what you consider a typical hunter/gatherer group size to be?

there were sun gods when we could not understand WHY the sun rose

probably anywhere from 10 to like 150

but in north america it was probably waaay more than that

hmm I take back my opinion then

i don't know what typical hunter/gatherer group size is. there are very few of them left now a days. we should look at them. maybe it would give us some ideas

I can see how religion can form even in small groups

well yeah of course

but there's an easy way to have a shared moral code without religion

I agree

the question is how far back religion formed? homo erectus?