I'm only for the death penalty in mass murder situations where the perpetrator was essentially caught in the act more as a burden of proof issue

Yeah, criminals and babies aren't the same. Though Democrats are generally incoherent, they at least acknowledge people should pay a price for crime

Not everyone who gets charged is the actual perpetrator. You can come back from being jailed (usually) but not from being killed

There's also the "when human life starts" debate, and not all pro choice people are hippies

The Libertarians that act like killing someone as retribution for murder is the same as killing an innocent person and therefore is hypocritical annoy me so much I don't want to agree with them

You are arguing a great many things. Both are worth consideration, so its good to keep talking about them. But try not to conflate the 2 is all. @DJ_Anuz
It is possible for a human to have contradicting ideas in their lives, it happens all the time (some do it more then others). Whats important, is how we justice our own beliefs and how well they work out in reality.

Pro choice libertarians annoy me the most like lmao

@Shadows Fair enough.

I'm not 100% sure where i stand on the death penalty. It would be an easier choice for me if we didn't put to death the wrongfully accused. But such is life, full of difficult choices.

Yeah, I struggle with it

I used to be staunchly opposed to it because of the whole not being 100% sure of guilt thing.

Now I struggle with it too.

I might lean towards against.... But its hard to say.

Kind of oddly I was more against it when I was a hardline atheist because I was so convinced death was the absolute end.

Now I am more inclined to spirituality and think it might be less final than that.

I still think it might be wrong to kill except in defense though so...

I'm not sure how good it is to judge someone based on what may or may not happen after life, but to each their own. :)

It's not a justification exactly. Just a removal of one of the stronger reasons to be staunchly against.

I still come down mostly anti.

Lol as a Christian I guess you could say I should be against based on what I think will happen to them after they die

I think murderers are in their own personal hell on Earth.

So you're saying it would be humane to end their suffering @DJ_Anuz? XD

In some instances. Maybe.

Like if I got bone cancer in my skull I would immediately seek euthanasia.

Course that's a little different

From mental hell.

@uncephalized I know, but to me i just thought of.
We shouldn't put this person to death because nothing after life exist.
We should put this person to death because life after death happens.
Or vise-versa, seems odd to me in in all versions of this, because what if anyone/everyone is wrong.
I'd rather deal with what is know when judging these things. But i guess others can do it differently heh.

So aren't, I don't know that Charles Manson minded his life in prison necessarily

Well I definitely believe in letting people choose death over imprisonment @DJ_Anuz

Actually framing it against euthanasia is probably a better comparison

@Shadows yeah your reasoning is sound. It's just an emotional/outlook shift on my part that I find interesting.

@micamike45 I was thinking about framing it vs killing off old people before they become to much of a burden lol.

@micamike45 equivalent to putting down a rabid or vicious dog?

Because I'm anti euthanasia so you COULD say it isn't right to only let people out if they've committed a heinous crime

@uncephalized Yep, its always good to revisit your personal beliefs.

I am 100% in support of voluntary euthanasia

Had a friend go through bone cancer in his head. I would literally rather chop of my dick and bleed out than go through that.

Its something that i think we should allow for, people shouldn't have to suffer if we can no longer do anything for them.

What kind of pain qualifies though? What's the point where you can tell a doctor who's sworn to do no harm to kill you?

That's just a motto (and a good one), doctors very much do a lot of harm (mostly in an effort to heal you). But, like i said before these are all tough decisions.

Any kind of pain qualifies in my book. If you truly would rather die than go through a certain amount of pain that should be your choice. Doctor's don't need to be doing the killing. Just give you the tools.