Message from @Tarbram
Discord ID: 315633496557223936
Okay and it didn't break from ML thinking
Pointing out Revisionism isn't a break from basic ML thinking
Hoxhaism I don't think should be considered its own separate ideology, then again I am of the belief that Marxism-Leninism is the highest stage.
Well MLM can be considered an addition to ML thought as it does offer some real rifts from original thought but Hoxhaism doesn't really do the same
A real difference and rift needs occur between ideologies for them to be considered different
I disagree, I don't agree with Mao's law of contradictions nor do I believe many of Maoist tenants are universally-applicable.
I mean, sure Maoists think so, but I don't hold that opinion myself.
Well yes Maoism isn't universally-applicable especially with his idea of New Democracy which is used to bring states from Feudalism to a somewhat Capitalist state run by the Proletariat with the Peasants along side the petty and national bourgeois. That is completely unnecessary in a nation that has already Capitalistic and thusly you can end the Capitalist stage through State Capitalism with the Party apparatus taking over the economy and then afterwards having the transition to socialism. And the other difference is Mao didn't believe that the Proletariat needed to be the head of the Proletariat Revolution if there weren't many Proletariats, while Hoxha believed that the Proletariat should always be those at the head of a Proletariat Revolution and if a state doesn't have many Proletariats then a strong Vanguard based around them needed to be made.
Personally through my firm belief in Historical Materialism I find what Hoxha talked about more Dialectical as Capitalism is necessary to remove tribalism and feudal concepts but at the same time the combination of Cultural Revolution and New Democracy can do the exact same thing
Do you know how Hoxha achieved 0% taxes?
Most Socialist States have zero direct taxes but there are still some taxes. And they can mainly do that because they sell goods to foreign markets they can use that money and through tariffs
so for example in world socialism when all the economy is planned with cybernetics and there isn't any surplus from the production, taxes would exist?
Taxes would no longer be necessary to run a governor
I believe taxes under stain were fairly low as well
because there was really no need for it
Because surplus value went towards programs that, under capitalism, require a large amount of taxation
Although I haven't read much about Hoxha, for what I have seen so far, it seems more aligned with Marxism than Maoism.
Marx was actually pretty clear in the historical progression through Dialectical Materialism and how capitalism was not only unavoidable, but also had a sort of "historical mission" in overthrowing Feudalism, and Mao seems to ignore or flee from that
Maoism is a part of Marxism-Leninism. I thought the same way but Mao introduced the idea of New Democracy in which a Capitalist stage would occur guided by the Proletariat with help from the Peasantry, Petty and National Bourgeoisie. With Cultural Revolution it does everything to void Feudal Culture and Hierarchy move into Capitalism and after that make it easy for moment into Socialism.
Hoxha applies is the industrialized world while Maoism applies in the pre industrialized places of the world
Hmm, makes sense. Does that mean the China still could return to socialism? And this is the phase of capitalism? How do maoists see this?
No it can't but revisionist PSL thinks so.
I mean, it can but there would have to be some kind of cultural revolution or second socialist revolution to get rid of the bourgeoisie.
This is something that I still need to read about, but I must admit it's really intriguing about Maoism.
Mao did have the country turn into Socialism, New Democracy was very brief. Deng brought the Capitalism through pushing for special economic zones which were massively increased by Zimmin. Deng would describe what he did as a Capitalist stage with Two Stage Theory making it while Maoists would call it Revisionism. Maoists hate modern china and seek revolution.
Yeah, I expected that, and seems to the correct position
There are a lot of people within China, especially the youth sect of the official communist party, that are maoists and seek to return China to socialism.
I also have heard that Xi Jinping has started a program of intensifying and re-applying classes of Marxism in universities, but his intentions probably aren't really good
I am really looking forward to discover what Xi meant by "a return to Marxist roots" as he repeatedly said in speeches. I can almost feel more revisionism.
Even if Xi wanted to do that, it would fruitless form the top-down because huge swaths of bourgeois class members entered the party for decades.
I personally believe Deng did what was necessary to advance Industrialization and make the West dependent on China. I also see Xi Jinping's removal of all possible rivals (which are all of Zimmin's faction), his massive consolidation of power, and his father being one of Mao's closest allies to all be signs of a possible return to Maoist policies seeing that he would need China to be unified and need massive amounts of power to insure that none of the Capitalist Billionaires and Party Members loyal to them could try to stop this return into Maoism.
Well, it would not be a return into Maoism. China was never Maoist in the theoretical sense. Maoism was not developed until the 1980s, and in Peru.
By Maoist China most people mean China under Mao.
But that's what most MLMs want anyway, a return to socialism and the implementation of Marxism-Leninism-Maoism while shaving off his right deviations.
I could just be me being optimistic but I don't see any real reason for Xi to seize so much power and influence just to keep the status quo
Well, who knows, maybe it turns out all the revisionism since Deng was all a plan? lol