Its a distinction without much of a difference

yes but one is going to legitimize them more than the other

its going to make it harder to rally around that person

They already have the legitimacy

you arnt taking if from them

They have the frame not the legitimacy

this is the status quo

Those who have the frame have the legitimacy

@Zemo not much of a difference in practicality

That may be true, but it’s not as if they’re aren’t measures we can take to maximize our own legitimacy

minimizing theirs will be more effective

Maximizing yours while they still have theirs is impossible anyways

We would need a media apparatus comparable to theirs in order to accomplish that

In a situation like this legitimacy is a zero sum game

in other words, you have to weaken them and take over or replace some of their power in order to gain some form of legitimacy or the ability to somewhat frame things for yourself in a meaningful way.

Before that you are pond scum

people still see things though.
we can't control the enemy, but we can at least make ourselves less fringe to those who are swayable. optics could be part of respectability

people will judge you on what you wear on your sleeve

@NeoFuturist totally agreed in that point, dress up a bit. But it's not that by dressing up they will treat you with kid gloves.

yeah sure, i agree

both optics and respectability are important, we shouldn't downplay either

I agree as well

Optics and Respectability are one in the same in my mind

thinking about it now, optics could be a part of respectability

Respectability is everything

optics is your choice of aesthetics, wording, culture, and looks

people judge on that, and if they judge you bad, your respectability is damaged, no?

the right is not respectable by the enemy, but we could be respectable for some near the middle

It only matters if that is actually what you are.
If its just a look (which 90% of people view optics as) then your wasting your time.

i think looks can reflect the soul of the thing

wignats show what they feel and act

Humans are highly visually driven creatures

how you dress is a form of art in my eyes, which is why we need more art

Hawaiian shirt nationalism?

hah lmao

i mean, not my favorite, but if it works

And even then though it may be called Optics, it’s much more than just a look

It’s the words you choose

@Zemo the result is the same as a wignat, you get called a racist or are just not shown on media.

But see thats actually what you are.
You actually believe that putting on a suit has intrinsic artistic or aesthetic value outside of putting on a show.
In that case optics are relevant because you want to portray something that you want others to emulate and you adhere to

yeah, that's exactly why i think they are important