Message from @Deleted User
Discord ID: 591324190423121931
They have authority over us
What about cases where Protestant Pastors have done miracles? Are these just fakes or does the Holy Spirit work thru anyone it wants to, or is only bound to heritage?
According to?
Like the sacrament of orders
Christ
@Deleted User God isn't bound to anybody or anything, He does what He pleases. Anybody could perform a miracle if God wills it so.
@Spydig But you mentioned only the sucessors of the apostles are granted these powers?
So they only have authority based on historical lineage rather than being spiritually unique
???
Only the successors of the apostles are granted legitimate apostolic authority
Not authority to e.g., perform miracles
So the Holy Spirit can create miracles thru any denomination, be it catholic or protestant?
Yeah, whenever He wants to, that's up to Him
Right so have there ever been any successors that have deviated from the Church's teaching?
Through a Muslim is He really wanted to
Yes @Oboe
current ~~pope~~
Example
Arius
Yes, many
Men are fallible but the Holy Spirit is not
And these people having the lineage to the apostles should be justified through their authority to define doctrine?
They can define doctrine in a very limited sense.
*very* limited
But if they used that authority to contradict scripture is nullified?
Can anyone define doctrine who isnt of the historical lineage?
Not really, like they can, but it wouldn't be as reliable
Of course we have layman biblical scholars and everything
They can’t contradict any of three things. A. Sacred Scripture B. Sacred Tradition C. Sacred Magisterium
But that's not the same as the teaching authority of the Church defining a doctrine
Now, I know this may be a bit difficult but do you have any sources that proves absolutely that either an apostle or a disciple of an apostle believed in doctrine such as infant baptism, the veneration of saints, or a literal interpretation of the bread and blood?
Not necessary
Is that a no?
Did I say no?
You didn't give a direct answer
I was asking if you had it
brb
back
My answer is that it’s not relevant. I can provide sources that the college of bishops, as the direct successors to the apostles, have defined dogmatically the real presence of the Eucharist. And have authorized and recommended both infant baptism and veneration of saints
My issue is whether we confirm that these traditions are truly apostolic