Socialism is an economic model where the workers have control over the means of production. This can be achieved through any means, but it is not achieved through the state ACTING ON BEHALF of the worker. In order for state socialism to be socialism, the worker must have control of the state

This is socialism

Usa, hong kong, france, germany, etc

Not real capitalism.

Not what you just said

I haven't seen it been tried

USA hong kong etc aren't capitalist

all have state intervention

Muh but that isnt REEEL capitalism

I haven't seen socialism been tried either.

Let's grab a wide range of definitions

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism

wikiepedia

@The Big Oof It's actually workers or state ownership

@Kazimir Malevich we have

No, you are WRONG

we've seen the State own the mop

and the workers in some cases

"communes"

state ownership is ONLY socialism when it's the workers who run the state

all have failed

But workers run the state

Capitalism, from the very beginning, has allowed state intervention

I think mises even said this

Nope

The USSR in that sense was not socialist, but it is the closest thing we will ever get to it

No he didn't rofl

Mises is an Austrian

He did

the defintion I used is directly from him LOL

And?

You think like socialists to, ironic that you're arguing against them

Finna show

USSR was socialist , the state owned the Mop

"Anything I don't like is capitalism"

"Anything I don't like is socialism"

No

It's just that it's that any state intervention is socialist

@sɪᴅɪsɴᴏᴛʜᴇʀᴇ I just explained why you're wrong with your definition. At this point you are resorting to circular reasoning in an attempt to avoid addressing the poiunt

You didn't say anything such

you just gave your own

🤦