Message from @Scale_e
Discord ID: 600524082102009866
@Ϻ14ᛟ how would you categorize people like ramzpaul? the classic "alt-right adjacent"? He's a bit closer than alt-lite folks tend to be
@ManAnimal - A lot of Catholic Monasteries operate on a communist mode, producing their own goods and selling some to subsidize their operation. Many of them are self-sufficient.
A lot of Jewish Yeshivas were the same way, at least for a while.
both couldn't exist without leeching off of investment from the more prosperous
“Alt lite” a term used to describe people we don’t like for whom “alt right” is far too preposterous.
the catholic church funded them
Not all of these communities have a benefactor.
When communism works, you typically see it in connection with hyper-religious communities.
and the church was propped up by what they took from others
@yearspastmatter Ramzpaul is Alt Right. He is a White Nationalist and at the very least interested in Third Position (listen to his discussion with Cultured Thug he talks about this) he is just more careful with how he presents himself.
communism DOESN"T work
it just moves resources around like robin hood
without the rich there is no one to steal from
@ManAnimal - Tons of cults have done the same, and made it work. At least for a little while.
Communes have been a thing in the United States for decades, as have worker owned businesses (more syndicalist than communist though).
and the system collapses
always
Homeland still exists. Worker owned.
understood but the fact remains these are always parasitic groups
Homeland as a grocery store closely reflects what you might see in a communist system.
That's not an endorsement, just an example of communism in practice.
that cannot sustain themselvees withut an outside sponsor
@Scale_e Think of it as a scale. On one end you have NeoCon and on the other end you have Alt Right, then between Alt Right and NeoCon is Alt Lite. Its pretty simple to understand.
Alt Lite is a term to describe people who fit where I just explained they fit.
My issue with communism is that people never scale it up incrementally, and implementation at a large scale always seems to come with massive human rights abuses.
@Arthur Grayborn these communes you describe... aren’t communist. They are cooperatives existing within a capitalist country. They work because they can still engage in the capitalism that exists around them.
it cannot be scaled incrementallly
National Socialism, isnt socialism (as in Stalin/Lenin socialism) change my mind
@Scale_e - Cooperatives dominating an economic system, with more central management, would effectively turn the system into a "socialist" economic system.
because those providing the inpute will always divert that input
Yeah you could say its like Nordic country socialism, or even some DNC members
bill gates or steve jobs wouldn't have invented computers without individual incentives
But I mean like stalin socialism
@Vir It is a form of Socialism, but its non-Marxist socialism. Socialism doesn't have to be a bad word, its not Communism.
inevitaby people just do the min they can and get by
you can't force a person to create or improve if they don't beleive in the fairy tale
My point is that there are examples of syndicalism, communism, and socialism that nobody minds. Few people have an issue with it.
It's more when people try to scale it up, they usually do a shit job of it.
For every functional state owned utility, there are two more than are run like shit because political pandering becomes more critical to job promotion than qualification or capability.
but you can incentivize them based on what they want themselves which they can purchae with capital
i see where you are going but those are not the same
they aren't systems of economics
they are systems of cooperation
Socialism = State owns the means of production.
Communism = Socialism, but with less central control and less inequality (IE - Your manager's apartment is no bigger than yours)
it's more than that
that is just the theory
it's about the DECISION of allocation
what type of factory to build and when?