Message from @Seedle

Discord ID: 332569203515326465


2017-07-06 17:05:22 UTC  

Period.

2017-07-06 17:05:42 UTC  

No third-party regulations from the state, where it can be bribed and legislated out of existence.

2017-07-06 17:06:19 UTC  

I don't think so, the best people in the sector are the best, simply because they'd get richer for their better services, something stifled currently by governments colluding with big business

2017-07-06 17:06:33 UTC  

I agree with your last point, but not on how to do it

2017-07-06 17:06:44 UTC  

A bigger socialist government is just as volnurable

2017-07-06 17:07:28 UTC  

I disagree. People who are rich aren't rich necessarily for being "the better" at services.

2017-07-06 17:07:33 UTC  

Bankers scam people all the time

2017-07-06 17:07:34 UTC  

"real socialists"

2017-07-06 17:07:40 UTC  

Wells Fargo just got caught doing it.

2017-07-06 17:08:01 UTC  

COMMUNISM HAS NEVER BEEN TRIED BEFORE

2017-07-06 17:08:12 UTC  

True, but that's because they can buy power from the governments, shrink the governments in areas it's not needed and you get fair competition

2017-07-06 17:08:35 UTC  

No bailouts for one

2017-07-06 17:09:00 UTC  

But when this "shrinkage" goes on, it eliminates the protections of the working-class. In reality, to the bourgeoisie, it's an opportunity for investment.

2017-07-06 17:09:06 UTC  

Let's take my country for example, America.

2017-07-06 17:10:00 UTC  

We're currently trying to repeal Obamacare (a shitty system nonetheless) to free the healthcare market up, so people may invest. Democrats and Republicans have their own lobbyists and rich people they appeal to, and Obamacare represented another side of that bourgeois interest.

2017-07-06 17:10:05 UTC  

get what I mean?

2017-07-06 17:10:27 UTC  

The current system is fucked, we both agree

2017-07-06 17:10:45 UTC  

No fan of the neocons and neo libs

2017-07-06 17:11:11 UTC  

I would say you are more Libertarian, but the thing is, self-regulation with capitalism is unattainable. That's why we have regulations come about in the first place.

2017-07-06 17:11:16 UTC  

And we end up in the same cycle.

2017-07-06 17:11:39 UTC  

A lot of regulation is very positive for certain sectors though

2017-07-06 17:11:56 UTC  

If you agree those politicians are bought and paid for, they're not making it easier for new businesses

2017-07-06 17:12:05 UTC  

Take the high tax for private businesses for example

2017-07-06 17:12:12 UTC  

The new businesses of today are the big businesses of tomorrow.

2017-07-06 17:12:21 UTC  

The average joe pays for it, the big business simply put their stuff in panama

2017-07-06 17:13:13 UTC  

I agree. There is a gap between the small businessman and the big businessman, but the dynamic between what the worker may do and the employer can do in the present and future is still there.

2017-07-06 17:13:25 UTC  

I'm not arguing for a big government.

2017-07-06 17:13:45 UTC  

I don't want the state to nationalize everything, unless they have to when they're under attack.

2017-07-06 17:14:12 UTC  

I want worker's councils, unions, etc so the workers have a direct say in government and the economy. That's what socialism is about.

2017-07-06 17:14:32 UTC  

We can't have that without interfering with the Bourgeois' interest though.

2017-07-06 17:14:55 UTC  

That's an observable fact throughout history.

2017-07-06 17:15:25 UTC  

What happens when a new company comes up, and agrees that he owns the company, he'll run it without the counsels and manages to get big.

2017-07-06 17:15:32 UTC  

What happens to that guy in your society?

2017-07-06 17:16:07 UTC  

He wouldn't be allowed to run it without the council's democratic say in the first place.

2017-07-06 17:16:13 UTC  

It depends on the area, but in socialism

2017-07-06 17:16:22 UTC  

that kind of one man owns everything ownership does not exist.

2017-07-06 17:16:25 UTC  

Why not? It's his idea and he has people who consent to letting him keep it

2017-07-06 17:16:29 UTC  

Because it creates the inequality we talk about it.

2017-07-06 17:16:49 UTC  

You never said anything about people consenting to it.

2017-07-06 17:16:57 UTC  

The inequality now comes from that guy being taxed to high hell by government