Message from @el pebble
Discord ID: 521771081548169227
You have not read anything I said
I specifically partition acting on determination and it being a factor of eternally knowing
I am divided, I understand your reasoning but I will need to think about this long afterwards to fully grasp the full extent of it. But you may be wrong as well.
Like what you do you would do in all scenario the exact same as the one you are in. Along with everyone else in their scenarios. Meaning God just knows what we will do but is not forcing us to do this. @el pebble Am I somewhat understanding what you are saying right?
@Victor Von Doom God does not predetermine the action, but what happens is determined to happen by virtue of eternal knowledge being present. That means we inherently will do what is determined but we freely choose this divinely known trajectory @Victor Von Doom
This is where we decide free will is not true
Because we are not choosing without arbitration a set of outcomes
Because what was said before posits other outcomes are imaginary and not possibly entertained
So since we were born everything that has happened was going to happen, but at the same time we chose our actions which led to this?
Issue is if we assume the omnipiscent god, then he knows what you will do no matter what you choose to do far into the future, in that sense it is determiend. However you are yourself not aware of what is to happen however you will do it anyway. There is a greek tragedy that goes along with this in how the oracle tells a boy he will kill his father, the boy grows up and leaves purposefully to avoid doing this, meeting an old man on the street, a beggar who latches on to im he accidentally kills him, and upon returning home learns that the man he killed was his father.
its that sort of thing, this man knew what was the result but was unable to chage it albeit trying to avoid it he in fact led to the very outcome he tried to avoid. If we choose things each day they set us on a course unless we decide otherwise. Each time we decide otherwise we are set on a new course and as such each decision predetermines a set of conditions we will encounter. With everyone doing this at the same time we are in a way predetermined to do something when we are 80 because of what we did when we are 5 even though these are seemingly unrelated decisions and events. However the nature of being omnipiscent is that of knowing the future as well.
@Bogatyr Bogumir I agree and appreciate the well worded explanation.
they just want to leech off the welfare
@Victor Von Doom so free will cannot exist
Because there is no decision free from arbitration
@el pebble God can just give us free will
He isn't bound by our laws of logic
@Doctor Anon that is not a solution to the issue
And you are assuming God's nature
I said can
It's a null point
Including giving us free will to choose or reject Jesus
@Doctor Anon you are freely choosing the determined path
But it isn't free will as in picking from possible outcomes
Without arbitration
You can change your outcome
Otherwise there is no reason to even try
@Doctor Anon I don't think you're understanding
From what I'm gathering from what you said, wether I enter heaven or hell is already decided for me
And cannot change
The final result will not change
You will always pick the choices that are determined
That idea literally negates religion, and any purpose of spreading it because who cares? We're already decided who is going where
Which is insane
Why is it being determined meaning to negate religion?
Why not spread it even more?
Because people are already destined for hell or heaven
Yes, people who accept the gospel go to heaven and people who reject it go to hell
No one can truly accept or deny Jesus because where they go is already decided
You say decided as if someone plucked souls and put them in decisions