Message from @Beemann

Discord ID: 481859642113392651


2018-08-22 16:13:41 UTC  

No they don't. They have entire organizations underneath them that keep things running

2018-08-22 16:14:03 UTC  

Fucking Stalin wasn't going to show up to nick you for jaywalking

2018-08-22 16:14:03 UTC  

yeah, and? one person runs it, people follow that person

2018-08-22 16:14:17 UTC  

just like my dad is the head and my mom follows, and they force their will on me

2018-08-22 16:14:21 UTC  

Right, and the authority limits the space controlled

2018-08-22 16:14:23 UTC  

they can easily come after me if i leave

2018-08-22 16:14:42 UTC  

Yes, and 2 people is not a military

2018-08-22 16:14:52 UTC  

2 people vs 1 person? why not.

2018-08-22 16:15:14 UTC  

1 person can be as effect as a whole army.

2018-08-22 16:15:20 UTC  

how many people are needed to be a military?

2018-08-22 16:15:51 UTC  

personally, i think the only thing separating your usual family, and the state, is just a matter of scale.

2018-08-22 16:16:00 UTC  

so then what is the min amount to be called a state

2018-08-22 16:16:16 UTC  

>one person can be an entire professional organization

2018-08-22 16:16:26 UTC  

There's more to it than scale, but scale is a large part of it

2018-08-22 16:16:59 UTC  

thats fine, why are you not defining scale then. outside nebulous terms. just go "military is at least 100 people" or something like that.

2018-08-22 16:17:11 UTC  

"goverment needs at least 20 people"

2018-08-22 16:17:17 UTC  

Because it's not a flat number, it's a style of organization

2018-08-22 16:17:26 UTC  

A government isn't just 50 dads

2018-08-22 16:17:42 UTC  

so then a family unit could be a state, but is not always.

2018-08-22 16:17:59 UTC  

No, a family unit on its own could not be a state

2018-08-22 16:18:11 UTC  

A family unit could become head of a state

2018-08-22 16:18:21 UTC  

Could occupy the positions within a state

2018-08-22 16:18:41 UTC  

if i am on an island, with just me and my family, are they not the state?

2018-08-22 16:18:56 UTC  

they "own" the whole island

2018-08-22 16:18:59 UTC  

i was just born there

2018-08-22 16:19:21 UTC  

They only own it by virtue of you willingly following them. If you decided not to, you'd be fucked

2018-08-22 16:19:31 UTC  

i pointed the answer of this issue out earlier

2018-08-22 16:19:37 UTC  

If you decide tomorrow not to pay taxes you'll get fucked

2018-08-22 16:19:37 UTC  

Group of people is a family,
Group of families is a community,
Group of communities is a town,
Group of towns is a country,
A countries leaders is called a state?

2018-08-22 16:19:38 UTC  

is that not different that now?

2018-08-22 16:20:41 UTC  

so then they are the state if they are willing to use force. and the government can become not a state if they don't use force?

2018-08-22 16:21:14 UTC  

if i stop paying taxes, and "the state" goes "well fuck.... okay" and thats it. are they still "the state"

2018-08-22 16:21:21 UTC  

No, if a bully beats you up, he is not the state

2018-08-22 16:21:46 UTC  

if i tell my dad on this island "i'm not giving you half the food i personally picked today" and he beats me up. why is he not the state?

2018-08-22 16:22:39 UTC  

Because you are both ultimately sovereign. His ability to control you only extends so far as he can beat you and you don't cause him sufficient harm

2018-08-22 16:22:55 UTC  

is that not true of the state?

2018-08-22 16:23:00 UTC  

Because words have definitions and 'state' is not just 'person or people who tell me what to do'

2018-08-22 16:23:06 UTC  

You cannot sufficiently harm a state

2018-08-22 16:23:21 UTC  

why not?

2018-08-22 16:23:21 UTC  

You on your own with a big stick are not going to dismantle social organization

2018-08-22 16:23:50 UTC  

so then the state is at least 2 people.