This server is regressive.

I wonder if protestants still can make an argument that they are saved though because they believe in "jesus's sacrifice"

Is it true that the Catholics interpret Old Testament violence metaphorically and allegorically rather than historically?

Job?

All Sin is equal

@Deleted User

Sure

@Deleted User I think I like Anselm's points on this issue so go ahead

whats an unforgivable sin?

Would doing an unforgivable sin be like what it sounds... i.e. eternal hell?

No repentance can save you from that?

So converts are exempt from this? if you blaspheme against HS while practicing a previous religion, would that still be unforgivable?

Wait mortal sin can be forgiven even post-death?

Then whats the difference between mortal and unforgivable?

So a Catholic could theoretically live a pious life with all the right beliefs and die in mortal sin going to hell and A Muslim could go to heaven ... thats a big plot twist

I thought a Muslim could go to heaven in catholicism under certain conditions like truly believing their religion and not being in mortal sin

He is not so correct teaching there

@OrthoBro Thats not a teaching. Dont spread misinformation. Islam has better things to worry about than paul

Islam does not give such a title, no.

Nrwhere is paul mentioned in the Qu'ran or hadith

He is not really relevant like Jesus is.

Yeah an online article with an anonymous author and shitty layout is not an authority on Islam. The Quran and hadith is.

He is not talked about anywhere

Not really an important figure

Thats not a real teaching either. Dont be so gullible

>My claim gets stomped so I have to startinsulting his religion

I would not either which is whyI am not a Christian

Dude, they don't talk about him. he is an irrelevant figure, nowhere is he mentioned anywhere in the Qu'ran or hadith. Malikis don't say anything about him

Well he clearly can't get me because he can't justify his claim using any Islamic scripture.

You can believe whatever you want. Just don't spread misinformation. This place is already enough of an echochamber and I see no good convo coming out of it.

I am not surprised everyone is Christian. If you were reading, I am saying I am surprised it is this much of an echochamber that views are assumed and shut down instantaneously.

That's the definition of an echochamber when views which are viewed to be inferior and their adherents are mocked by the collective.

There is literally 0 argument being made, it's legit childish insults. So much for being "Christ-like" it's just more evidence that Christians don't take Jesus very seriously.

Mate, you can think whatever you think. Just don't spread misinformation.

CIC c. 1083
14 for girls, 16 for boys

It's funny when a Catholic is accusing others of shanking Children though.

@CRYSS ⳩ That verse was to teach us the morals of visiting others.

Btw, Most Scholars think that Mary was 12 at the time of marraige.

14 is still a child though

So take your own medicine bud and stop making such poor arguments that can applied with equal force against your beliefs.

Yeah, that's still child marriage.

It's okay to marry children as long as you don't have sex with them, nice

Christianity is really really weak and any criticism you will make against Islam will be found in the Old Testament or in history.

Dude, it's not important that she did not have sex. She was a child bride.

Your religion teaches child marriage

Idc if you kick me, go ahead.

@OrthoBro No dude, Maliki is one of the 4 authoritative schools in Sunni Islam. Neither do Shafi or Hanabali even mention the figure. The only school that does mention him is Hanafi to say that "Christians believe in his writings". Nothing about him being "the corrupter". It is still the case that Islam does not talk about him anywhere in the Qu'ran or hadith. And Muslim don't regard North Africans as inferior. The Prophet said in his last sermon (recorded in Sahih Muslim): "A non-Arab is not better than an Arab nor is an Arab better than a Non-Arab".

You can't prove your false claim and you are a racist. Should quit the anti-African rhetoric. Cardinal Sarah would not like this.

@OrthoBro Youtube videos and an apostate of a non-muslim religion are not really primary sources or authorities on Islam. You are really struggling to justify your claim from actual Islamic sources. The slower you admit your error, the less seriously I take you. paul is not a significant figure in Islam. He is irrelevant. The take-away is this: Don't spread nonsense about the religions of others if you don't want nonsense spread about your own.

And Man to Man: Drop your racism. It's immature.

@Mozalbete ⳩ That comment was in reference to moral objections brought above. I obviously would not agree that the Prophet Muhammad contradicted the previous prophets. He has many miracles and prophecies surrounding his prophethood (https://yaqeeninstitute.org/series/proofs-of-prophethood/). Also, just leading war is not a reason to doubt someone's prophethood; you believe in the OT. Many of those prophets led wars and battles.

Well Jesus according to the classical account failed just about every checkbox

He failed many prophecies and Christianity paints him as a failure of a messiah (https://www.reddit.com/r/Judaism/wiki/jesus)

No, he does not wage constant war and there is nothing wrong with taking 1/5 of spoils as the head of the political state

That's just an ad hominem

Just because it was written by Jews does not make the argument bad

I am not interested in the didache.

I am not reading that wall of pasted text unless you make your argument yourself

They don't.

Yes and your prophets were commanded to kill women and children (1 Samuel 15:3)

Prophecies and miracles above, if you want to keep a blind eye, go ahead.

The Prophet Muhammad did not wage 15 military campaigns nor keep 17% of spoils. That's just a lie and again spreading misinformation.

And that second part is a strawman. None of the prophecies given by the prophet above had anything to do with rulers.

Dude, the prophecies given about jesus were not fulfilled.

He is a false messiah by your own standard.

Yeah, sahih hadiths nowhere mention 15 campaigns and 17% of spoils.

Again, your claims about Miracles and prophecies were addressed above. The prophet having wars is not really an argument against his prophethood. If it was, go ahead and dismiss the OT prophets who led wars.

Isaiah 7:14 says "young woman" not virgin. matthew was not educated about the OT or hebrew.

It's a classic blunder.

Isaiah 53 is not about the messiah

See Isaiah 43:9

Or rather Isaiah 49:3

> first becuse then there wouldn't be any sign of the messiah


That's literally begging the question. "It can't be young woman" because then it would not be about my messiah Jesus.

THat's literally standard circular reasoning.

It is not a messianic prophecy.

It's about Hezekiah IIRc.

Why should I think so?

Muslims already believe in the virgin birth and this passage is not about virgin birth nor a messiah

You did not engage my claims above about miracles, prophecies and war.

You completely droppted those and jumped the gun to prophecies about Jesus

Which Jesus failed to fulfill pretty much any (except donkey to Jerusalem)

>It was seen as a messianic prophecy even before Christ.

This is exactly what I am asking you to justify.

>Muhammed even had to come up with verses trying to explain why he had no miracles

That's not true.

You can't drop silly claims and expect me to take them as rebuttals.

>e didnt just reluctantly participate in a war for a goal determine by God,

That's literally circular reasoning again. For somebody who thinks Muhammad is a prophet. He would not share that assumption.

Why should I believe that claim?

Sixteen military campaigns.

And that's fine as said above. A lot of those were defensive or to spread a political empire.

He did not. He used it as tax (he was also head of state)

No he did not. he took those spoils and used them for infrastructure. He was clearly very poor (https://www.quora.com/Did-the-prophet-Muhammad-live-in-poverty)

Yes, he took a fifth which I did not deny.

Yeah, he can keep the money for himself and spend it on the infrastructure. By "keeping it for himself", that means it was reserved for him as head of state

Hadith is not holy scripture and the Quora has nothing but hadiths.

Yeah, Polygamy is fine.

I really don't care what you think is moral/immoral

Remember that the prophecies and miracles and the points on Jesus prophecies above were dropped by you.

Okay, then don't bring up irrelevant points.

The points on his miracles and prophecies were literally unscouthed.

Dropped just means that you stopped engaging them. And that is what the word means (https://outreachjudaism.org/alma-virgin/). Here is an orthodox Rabbi on it.

Okay and there are many more he did not fulfill. most of the alleged fulfilled ones are not even messianic.

That's again an ad hominem. Being a rabbi does not discount his argument.

I did not say they don't count. I am saying those are not about the messiah. Isaiah 53 is clearly about the servant Israel (Isaiah 49:3)

I am not reading walls of texts. If you want to make an argument, make it yourself.