^^

Thank yeh

marxism leninism is significanty different from marxisam

Socialism and Communism are different

What are these so-called socialist values?

And then the coup fell apart politically, and Gorbachev forced the dissolution of the Soviet union

Socialism doesn't have values

That's the problem

No sense of morality

@Deleted User democracy and worker ownership primarily @Governor Mitt Romney

this^

Socialism is a selfish belief, actually. It's the belief that since i'm breathing, i deserve something.

Yes

You deserve life

Are you guys authoritarian?

He had too since most of the Soviet states were openly rebelling/calling for capitalist democratic reform and self rule

No.

I'm not.

go and starve your children then

"Ace ANARCHIST"

Even Russia started

Some of you aren't far left

tell them they're moochers

That is the problem with having a debate

Leftism encompasses so many ideologies

cox is a fashy and aeon is a libertarian

we're not liberals

that's for sure

I'm fiscally conservative and socially liberal, but I have personal conservative beliefs.

I'm an anarcho syndicalist and Kropotkin I'm assuming is an anarcho communist

Anarcho-Capitalism is stupid

^^

yes

And anarcho Syndicalism is so close to anarcho communism that you might as well group them together so you're really just debating left wing anarchists

Let's debate Anarchy. Do you really think Anarchy would work?

MNever

capitalism requires a state to function

Humans tend towards selfishness

Well yes people don't need to have a gun pointed in their face to do the right thing

Some dp

humans tend toward self-interest

Most people do

And if worse came to worse the individual could point a gun at another individual

yes

Read mutual aid by Kropotkin

but this can be managed in collective ways

All life tends towards community and selflessness

So take advantage of it to better society

It's called capitalism

that's the idea of socialism

capitalism rewards the greedy

When individuals start pointing weapons one will take conquer and lead

Socialism is literally the art of pointing a gun at someone's head

CNT FAI

you've been debunked 😎

Capitalism rewards ingenuity

I can literally debunk half your arguments with the CNT FAI tho so...

Not really

dafuq how is worker self-management like pointing a gun at your head?

No it doesnt

Basically, in this proposed syndicate, if I wanted to have my own company, and run it my way because it's my private business and property, I can't do that otherwise the government will put me in jail, dead or alive.

CNT was that the little anarcho state during the Spanish civil war?

No

That encourages people to get better educations

Omg

If you want to own a business no one will work for you because they prefer a democratic workplace

Most people move past minimum wage jobs

If you want to form a business you can ask a bunch of guys if they'll run it with you

no, they just wouldn't call in the cops if the workers decide to collectivize it

Simp,e

Ace

That is very not true.

"If you want to own a business no one will work for you because they prefer a democratic workplace"

Yes it is tho?

CNT fai

the government not defending your property for you isn't putting a gun to your head

Are you assuming everyone would choose to not work in a company?

Literally exactly what happened there

Because tbh, if I were in that position, I would just judge by the wages.

would people rather live in a dictatorship or a democracy

That's anecdotal

That proves nothing that's just a quote

I've been spamming empirical evidence and historical examples

That's actually a good quote

I mean if you can back it up yeah

also we don't think a massive welfare state is managable in capitalism

Empirical evidence

Such as what

But I can prove you wrong in like three charts

Scroll up I spammed a shit ton

The government can't keep spending, and expecting profit when profits have been circlejerked by government programs and high involvement in places where it shouldn't have involvement.

No

Post it again, commie

i'm an anarchist soo

The CNT FAI was a Spanish workers party that work very short term till they faced threats from outside forces and they couldn't bring themselves to manage in a way to meet their enemies in a ordered military fashion which caused their downfall.