"Deaths resulting from my favorite policies are just woopsies, ignore"

you're saying the soviets deserved terrorism because you disagree with them

Murder by definition implies intent

you do not have murder without intent

```murder
/ˈməːdə/
noun
noun: murder; plural noun: murders

1.
the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another.```

Ok?

this was not premeditated

therefore,

not murder

and?

yes, its not intentional, and not murder. glad we agree

It was the Result of Soviet Collectivization is all I said

lol

Soviet State is responsible

it resulted from the decision to go forward with it, and was due to many factors that all joined up in the collectivisation era. but it was not intentional, its not like Soviet government *wanted* people to die, and once the thing was complete it never happened again. at most the famine can be called a tragic hickup

@Stern The farmers didn't deserve to be transported to Gulags run by a Foreign People and they didn't deserve to be starved while their produce was sent to the cities to Urbanization Projects, that's the Terrorism of the Soviet State

```Kulaks have no agency. Sabotage of crops and killing of livestock by the hundreds of thousands was done by NPCs who do not have moral agency by the virtue of not being sentient.```
- Storm, 2018

I said it was a Protest which was the result of Soviet Policy which anyway ended up killing millions while blaming small time farmers for it all

Collectivization resulted in the Famine, not Farmers Protesting.

if the farmers did not sabotage the crops, and did not kill literally hundreds of thousands of livestock, there's no telling how vastly lesser the famine could've been

this is unescapable

@Xinyue but nice memes bro

@AdorableStormtrooper no one deserves anything tbh

human rights are communist ideas

the Kulaks played a major part in this. Sure, the Soviet collectivisation set them in motion, yes, but the Soviets are not responsible to the frankly psychopathic actions of the kulaks in the era

@Xinyue if Soviets didn't plan Collectivization, which is an innans word for taking everything those Farmers had built.. there wouldn't be protests..

how many meals could've hundreds of thousands of livestock animals provided? or those crops whose harvest was prevented to the Soviet people?

```the Kulaks played a major part in this. Sure, the Soviet collectivisation set them in motion, yes, but the Soviets are not responsible to the frankly psychopathic actions of the kulaks in the era```


completely irrelevant, we're talking about the cause of the Famine

Which was indeed Soviet Policy.

Soviet Policy was ***not*** the sabotage of crops and killing of hundreds of thousands of livestock. That was ***Kulak Policy***

@Xinyue it would have all ended up in the cities anyway 😩

because you need grain for development right?

there's no escape from the fact that Kulaks were killing whatever could've been spent to alleviate any famine. They single-handedly are the amoral faction #1 in the birth of this famine

the ones whose intent was absolutely solid

@Xinyue Soviet Policy however was far worse, killing all the productive Farmers, replacing them with worse labor and transporting the produce to the cities..


```Soviet Policy was not the sabotage of crops and killing of hundreds of thousands of livestock. That was Kulak Policy```

@Xinyue all you're trying to do is muddly the waters

I've said time and time again that the Soviets killed 600K-700K people who *cannot be justified as kills*

irrelevant

and that this was the great moral failure of the Soviet Union

however,

the killing of the Kulaks came *after* their obstructionism