Message from @Grimm0175

Discord ID: 530244257211088897


2019-01-03 04:38:44 UTC  

yes this is what data would let us surmise

2019-01-03 04:39:00 UTC  

you are telling me about Chávez Period when i know what he even did before politics?

2019-01-03 04:39:02 UTC  

for real?

2019-01-03 04:39:04 UTC  

...

2019-01-03 04:39:08 UTC  

you are lost

2019-01-03 04:39:22 UTC  

there's no point debating with you, it's like Debating with a Chavista in my country

2019-01-03 04:39:34 UTC  

they are STUPID AS HELL, they are Fanatical debotes to Chávez

2019-01-03 04:39:41 UTC  

you asked me for the legacy of the Chavez period and I gave you it with context of what I know of it, its aims and its most general outlook (which, due to inability to read or speak spanish, is limited)

2019-01-03 04:39:44 UTC  

AND PLENTY OF THEM BELIEVE THAT CHÁVEZ IS A GOD

2019-01-03 04:39:49 UTC  

I'M NOT KIDDING

2019-01-03 04:39:58 UTC  

THEY EVEN BUILT A CHAPPEL IN HIS NAME

2019-01-03 04:40:13 UTC  

It is called "Capilla Santo Hugo Chávez"

2019-01-03 04:40:15 UTC  

I'm not a Chavista though, you might not want to project your preconceptions based on experiences in your country upon me

2019-01-03 04:40:37 UTC  

I tend to think that Chavism is *too soft*

2019-01-03 04:40:43 UTC  

soft?

2019-01-03 04:40:54 UTC  

it destroyed my country in 20 years

2019-01-03 04:40:56 UTC  

it didn't liquidate the capitalist sector of the economy, it did very little to annex it

2019-01-03 04:41:00 UTC  

it did

2019-01-03 04:41:14 UTC  

you guys keep saying that it destroyed your country in 20 years but you have absolutely no argument for it; this is pure propaganda point

2019-01-03 04:41:17 UTC  

when he started to take control over the main Oil company wich is

2019-01-03 04:41:22 UTC  

PDVSA

2019-01-03 04:41:33 UTC  

he fired 20.000 people that were working there

2019-01-03 04:41:36 UTC  

in wich

2019-01-03 04:41:41 UTC  

My parents are INCLUIDED

2019-01-03 04:41:54 UTC  

this people were very competent, and were against Chávez Politics

2019-01-03 04:42:21 UTC  

before PDVSA was taken by the Proletariat, it was a very competent company and they had a meritocracy system

2019-01-03 04:42:50 UTC  

they had a supervisor checking every single worker job so they can know their perfomance

2019-01-03 04:43:09 UTC  

one of the slogans of the company was "The Meritocracy is Excellence"

2019-01-03 04:43:54 UTC  

so back to the point, when this professional personal was fired from their jobs, Chávez simply give jobs for people that doesn't even know how to work in a Oil Company

2019-01-03 04:44:03 UTC  

as you can see, HDI and education both gained tremendously during the Chavez administration, and that inflation rates were at an all time low; further, poverty went down significantly and the country was making real progress. Sure, these were due to gradualist socialist policies rather than the clear-cut, transformative socialism of actual substance, but its still noteworthy and you cannot dismiss it as "destroying" your country.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/507035890640486411/530244931634331679/venezuela1.png

2019-01-03 04:44:05 UTC  

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/507035890640486411/530244940790497301/Venezuela_historic_inflation_vs._oil_revenue.png

2019-01-03 04:44:07 UTC  

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/507035890640486411/530244947710967808/INE_Venezuela_poverty_rate_1990_to_2013.png

2019-01-03 04:44:13 UTC  

in fact PDVSA's OIL production lowed to 1.500.000 Barrels

2019-01-03 04:44:40 UTC  

there was even Poverty before Chávez because

2019-01-03 04:44:50 UTC  

Like we can talk and exchange anecdotes all day but it will still be inferior to data and actual analysis of the economic and political factors at play

2019-01-03 04:45:16 UTC  

After the Overtrown of Marcos Pérez Jiménez wich was a Military Dictator with Conservative and Nationalistic Policies

2019-01-03 04:45:32 UTC  

the country was ruled for 40 years by Social-Democrats and Social-Christians

2019-01-03 04:46:13 UTC  

those Statistics doesn't match with the Reality

2019-01-03 04:46:15 UTC  

Join the afc y’all

2019-01-03 04:46:23 UTC  

there's a lot of Crime rates in Venezuela

2019-01-03 04:46:30 UTC  

Also Maduro was arguably the worst person to follow up on Chavez. He's completely incapable of doing anything and probably should be replaced *either* by a more competent figure within PSUV or, perhaps more preferably, by a leading figure of PCV