As can a last man.

So suffering is not the measure by which you should assess your goals.

yes but not all suffering is equal

@Five, Seven, and Two fogazzi philosopher

But equal suffering does not make for equal goals.

I dont deny that

@metal_mango You're drunk, I'll let this slide.

i sobered up, but bye

I thought you were going to sleep @metal_mango lol

i thought so too

lol

ok bye lol

👋

Are you saying that you don't need to suffer in order to achieve a lofty goal?

cuz then I disagree

No, I'm saying that suffering does not ensure a lofty goal.

I agree with that

I said the opposite

A lofty goal requires suffering

And suffering does not make a goal worthwhile or is even good for goals, either.

Indeed

wait

...is even good for goals?

As in suffering does not necessarily serve as a good or grounds for good in a goal you wish to achieve.

Yes but suffering is good and is apart of the higher mans goal

The last man can suffer a fools errand

If you're trying to paint a landscape and you trip on the doorframe of your house, and sprain your ankle, is that suffering either good or a part of the higher man's goal?

no ive already said not all suffering is equal

But then you say suffering is good...

Suffering in order to achieve a lofty goal is required and THAT suffering is good

not all suffering

But would you have tripped were you not coming and going so much to finish your painting? Is that required and/or good?

Or do you retroactively assign value to the suffering, once you're done?

no, but the suffering required to finish your painting is good and necessary

You falling on your ass is not good, it is not a goal

But if it is a part of it, unintentionally so?

definitely not

Those are not goals

and if you trip that has nothing to do with the painting

that has to do with your own clumsy ass lol

maybe make it a goal to not be so clumsy next time although this is not a goal of a higher man