Message from @Seven Of Swords

Discord ID: 487392418178662400


2018-09-06 22:35:38 UTC  

I never said that I was.

2018-09-06 22:35:55 UTC  

Don't cast stones in glass houses, as the saying goes.

2018-09-06 22:36:36 UTC  

then you have communist views all but in name :)

2018-09-06 22:36:59 UTC  

meh

2018-09-06 22:37:25 UTC  

there are many different schools of communist thought on the left.

2018-09-06 22:37:43 UTC  

it doesn't matter what you call it, you can call it the great religion of the beaten dogs, for all I care. the name is not what counts, it's the idea behind it, that wrecked societies throughout time

2018-09-06 22:37:43 UTC  

Not all of them necessarily agree on what communism is, much less who is and who isn't.

2018-09-06 22:38:09 UTC  

OK... is it one idea, or many different ideas?

2018-09-06 22:38:38 UTC  

the generic idea what you've been talking about is, the forced redistribution of wealth

2018-09-06 22:39:14 UTC  

I've never said that I was in favor of the forced redistribution of wealth.

2018-09-06 22:39:32 UTC  

If anything I'm much more radical and crazy.

2018-09-06 22:39:43 UTC  

I want people to be able to live without needing wealth at all.

2018-09-06 22:40:37 UTC  

That is much more freeing than needing a state or dictatorship of the proletariat to redistribute anything.

2018-09-06 22:41:49 UTC  

aha, and who would be producing your at least minimal needs for survival then?

2018-09-06 22:42:02 UTC  

in what sense, exactly?

2018-09-06 22:42:11 UTC  

food, shelter, water?

2018-09-06 22:42:36 UTC  

People would do it themselves without the need of capital, money, or the state.

2018-09-06 22:42:46 UTC  

but why would they?

2018-09-06 22:43:13 UTC  

wait, you mean you as an individual, would do it for yourself?

2018-09-06 22:43:18 UTC  

Because people don't want to be naked, cold or dehydrated lol

2018-09-06 22:43:27 UTC  

People would do it collectively.

2018-09-06 22:43:52 UTC  

Parents would still care for their children, and entirely new social organization would sprout up.

2018-09-06 22:43:59 UTC  

Like I said, its radical.

2018-09-06 22:45:24 UTC  

Imagine it more like this: People leave the society that is failing, and they go to make another one. They care for each other not for profit, but because they don't want to suffer.

2018-09-06 22:45:49 UTC  

They would farm, build shelter, and have water.

2018-09-06 22:46:16 UTC  

Using the knowledge that they have already previously learned from the society that they left.

2018-09-06 22:46:58 UTC  

Or perhaps, people in massive drives, by the billions, simply lose faith in the crumbling institutions and bring forth better ones.

2018-09-06 22:47:10 UTC  

you realize that's like going back to the neanderthal level of society, do you?

2018-09-06 22:47:15 UTC  

How so?

2018-09-06 22:48:30 UTC  

There is no reason to suggest that just because people decide to quit their 9-5s by the billions that they would somehow forget how to build or create new inventions lol

2018-09-06 22:49:07 UTC  

because traits that are needed nowadays to provide for the amount of people that live on the face of the earth, require technology, and a sophisticated one at it. what you imagine is that every people would be able to learn these traits, and exercise them for their survival. while this might be true for clarifying water and hunting, it might not be true for chemical engineering and industrial farming (much less mechanical engineering), that the industrial revolution brought

2018-09-06 22:50:39 UTC  

also, you would impose value on people that have rare traits others don't to trade their traits for the value they don't want to. they will simply go to other 'communities', and sell their traits there for the value they see fit

2018-09-06 22:50:41 UTC  

The computer programmer would take the computer that he already bought in the previous system, and create new data structures to use that don't rely upon IP rights or having to program as the sole driver of their ability to sell their labor.

2018-09-06 22:50:59 UTC  

No one would be imposing anything on anyone lol

2018-09-06 22:51:56 UTC  

People that are frustrated with the way things are in this society would "leave". These "Leavers" would come from all aspects of life. Computer Programmer, engineers, farmers etc.

2018-09-06 22:52:25 UTC  

You can find many people from those groups which could come together and produce a new means of social relations.

2018-09-06 22:53:31 UTC  

The people that would make up these communities would be disgusted by the idea of needing to sell anyone's labor power for survival.

2018-09-06 22:53:39 UTC  

okay, so let me pose an example: I as a mechanical engineer, would have to provide your community, because your community says so. another community would not need me to provide that amount of work for them, to get more food/shelter/whatever. I go there, you will only get mechanical engineers on a lower level to provide for your community, ending up on a lower quality of engines and stability on the long run. and the you would say I guess, that's not fair

2018-09-06 22:54:16 UTC  

1) Its not simply because the community says so, it would be because he would want to.

2018-09-06 22:54:43 UTC  

If he didn't want to then he could go somewhere else where he would want a profit for selling his labor power.

2018-09-06 22:56:30 UTC  

oh, then let me pose a more radical example:
Scenario 1: vicious people come to your community and slaughter the men/rape the women. since you hate the idea of violence
Scenario 2: certain people of your community will say, they will fight for your community, for being treated better and having to work less for their survival