@Punished Korgoth nat ural selection is a quality control process not a creative one, if you do quality control on car parts no matter how good a Job you do you will never get a plane

@AllThingsExpendable I discovered Ayn Rand, which kicked off me learning about libertarianism and mgtow/red pill. Have you ever read her philosophy?

It would be much better if mgtows actually came together on a serious effort to survive the collapse in my opinion

@Kaiser Dion Napoleon Is that a mental defence? Your subconicous doesnt want to be brainwashed so it naturally stays away from mainstream crap

That's what I think mgtows should be doing

@agogeghost Decadence to me implies many things, but here would be self-indulgence. There is responsibility in a family that contains a man. Without it, the probability of becoming decadent is there, which starts with self-indulgence - porn being a major factor.

@Kaiser Dion Napoleon From my understanding, MGTOW is simply a philosophy, like Objectivism, to be used for each INDIVIDUAL man. His authority alone is how he lives his life. It's not a movement like feminism.

@Reaper True. So it works in conjunction with positive mutation. Making it a creative one.

@Punished Korgoth well yeah. My independence is probably the best thing I've had consistently in life

@Kaiser Dion Napoleon as much as I like that idea, it'd necessarily open you up to doxxing which I would like to avoid

@agogeghost Although I considered myself Libertarian, I haven't actually read Ayn Rand. I plan on it, but I'm probably not a libertarian anymore.

@Kaiser Dion Napoleon Your an independant black wo...man

@Punished Korgoth you have to realize that even if true the probability of those things working together by chance is astronomical

What I think mgtows should be doing isn't even a movement. It's just a serious effort to preserve ourselves through a disaster

@AllThingsExpendable I do agree with you. Without service to a family, what will a single man do? He will do whatever he pleases. But... what is so wrong with that? If your goal is to control these men, I see your point. Otherwise, as long as men are respectful and follow the non aggression principle, why do you care?

@AllThingsExpendable What are you now, politically?

^

@Reaper Thats true, but it is still possible. and the universe is so big that almost anything can be possible

Because I don't want to just benefit myself from mgtow. I want the ideology to endure

especially on the qauntum level

@Kaiser Dion Napoleon It would be benifitial if that happened, the base point is people with similar values tend to migrate towards one another, that is how commuties of old formed.

@agogeghost Yeah, I guess my goal is to control these men, which is why I'm not a Libertarian anymore. Probably more of a Paleo-conservative. I believe individualism can only be sustained under a strong collective. MGTOW to me is a subversive element against the collective of men. Obviously, they have valid reasons, but solutions that aren't really solutions.

@Punished Korgoth no matter how much complexity you ad to the system, the fact that our little corner can operate in the way that it does can be no co-incidence

Communities of old didn't form from ideas, they formed from families

The family is the smallest unit of society, and since families break apart more these days, society is becoming increasingly dysfunctional

@AllThingsExpendable I do agree with you. As a civilization, if 30% or more of all men went MGTOW, it would be a disaster.

There would be a non-father tax created.

@AllThingsExpendable I do agree to a point, obviously if men don't procreate that would be disastrous for a society, however, personally, and in my opinion most MGTOW are reluctant, and are only MGTOW because the legal system is so fucked up

@agogeghost I also want to say that there will obviously be exceptions. To control all men or all people is never the answer, but most and most will follow something anyways.

@AllThingsExpendable However, in my mind. I don't think there should be a state at all or minimal (police/courts/military). The individual is the authority in their own life.

but it's also not my job to uphold a society that hates men so

I think as much as most MGTOW have their eyes open to many truths, if you believe our societies have been brought to this point by chance (all at the same time might I add) you are still extremely naive and will be taken advantage of more in the future

@Reaper Agreed.

^

@Reaper It can. The probability of a habitable world being formed is not zero

@Reaper it happened due to the societal cycle

@agogeghost I just don't find that idea that reasonable in reality. It's an abstract concept that educated people like to play with.

@agogeghost Man of my own mind on that. If you read some Jefferson, Madison, and Mason you'll see point along the very same line.

We've been too long in easy times

@Kaiser Dion Napoleon but why does the cycle exist?

@Reaper because of human nature