The most broad definition is any gov't spending

Too broad, implementation is what's important.

And that's what the Welfare state does mean, btw

We could talk about social security alone

And the point could be made

The Welfare in Welfare State does mean Spending on Services

*Semantics*

Also, Medicare, Medicaid, and Social aren't bad

Social security was necessary in the 20th century. Today you could invest the same amount into a Roth IRA and yield 30% larger returns.

They're steps in the right direction

It's still a necessary social safety net for those who fail to invest.

I would argue get rid of Medicate and just let everyone have Medicare

There's a reason welfare programs are woefully inadequate in comparison to a free market.

Well, unless you're talking Health Care

Especially health care.

No

Yes.

Private Health Care is awful, lol

Nationalizing health care would drastically increase the wait time, while reducing the quality, and quantity of services offered.

You want to talk about taxation without representation, the social security example is a good one. Paying into a system that will go broke that you have no part in.

You already have Wait times under the Private System

^ Agreed. You should have an opt-out on social security.

The Private Wait Times are based on the Size of your Wallet

However, because the system is a national social program, it would destablize it completely.

Public Wait times are on Need

Is not wealth transfers from the young to the old a form of misrepresentation?

"Need"

Christ

NO

Also, when you say "private healthcare"

Some rich guy with Stomach Aches in the US is higher priority than someone with a Stage 4 Cancer in the American System

In a Universal System, the wait times regard Priority. Someone with Cancer or who just suffered a Heart Attack, of course, is higher priority than you, who might be in for a minor fever. The higher priority niggas get almost instantaneous care while those who are lower priority might have to wait a little longer.

Nothing exists in a vacuum

Healthcare is a service. You have price, quality, or quantity - and you only get to pick 2.

Which do you want?

*economics*

You can't get everything you want, there's only bad and worse.

You're referring to a system similar to the organ donor list - which has demonstrated fatal consequences.

I refuse to allow the govt - an agency that have demonstrated countless failures in basic financial management - to have oversight on the quality and availability of my healthcare.

The quality of services would plummet. 2 Millions private healthcare jobs lost. Suddenly the budget can't keep up with demand as it's not an established system.

There's a reason M4A is rejected by the majority of Americans. We do not need an American NHS.