Message from @Guy
Discord ID: 537474632366948354
No, but it's a marker of history and social progress. And ultimately, that social progress is something that will have an impact on the way you interact with others. So, knowing the reality of our government is pretty important
Honestly, I don't know
I don't really care to convince her
She's not a great person
Who are you to decide social progress?
In what way do you mean that?
I'm not "deciding social progress"
Someone has to define it
It's a subjective term
Oh right
I mean it as in that, we need to know the society we live in is one where racism and sexism and, in general, discrimination, is "passable", "accepted", "fought", etc. And to assess that, you need to look at different levels: popular activism, the way of the market, the government, etc.
Looking at it this way, I'd say knowing whether or not the president believes in racial discrimination plays a huge role in knowing our own social climate.
are you in high school? just wondering
Not for much longer.
ok
@Guy I discriminate against people all the time.
Also, the definition of racism keeps changing, and 'sexism' today is 'chivalry' 40 years ago
Right, language is fluid, everything is transitory. I'll just establish as part of the terms of whichever debate I'm a part of, that racism is discrimination based upon race, ethnicity or skin color and sexism is discrimination based upon sex.
Is that alright to do?
Fair enough, but that's not what I'm getting at
Do you consider 2019 to be more 'socially progressive' than 1957? I would assume you do.
Why? It is *different*, but is it *better?*
And you're right in discriminating against people (I do watch Sargon and that revelation did hit me!)... It's just discrimination because uncontrollable assets of a person at birth such as race, etc. that is often immoral (depending how you define discrimination at this point)
To you
Don't assume that
I haven't made that claim
Also, what is the list of 'uncontrollable' assets now?
Is that gender? Sexuality? Ideology?
that social climate thing is pretty tricky for a few reason, the number one reason probably being the fake outrage and twisting of definitions doesn't give you a clear image of reality when it comes to actual racism and sexism, nor does what the president believes.
We're kind of getting to the big problem when it comes to talking about... humans, in general. Things can be made very subjective, very easily
Also... why would ideology be uncrontrollable
youd need to have mental problems
And my point is that 'progress' is a subjective term that should not be made a goal
I'm going to have to disagree
Look, 20 years ago, we would have said 73 genders was 'mental'. Now, to discriminate against that is a crime
one mans progress is another mans hell
We should always shoot for progress as long as, firstly, there is progress to be had (for this first part, I have reasons to say there is progress to be made, will share if necessary), and secondly, it actually is progress. It's that second part that's the big, bad issue, and that's why we need to always entertain a discussion about it. But looking at it this way, it's unwise to say that progress shouldn't be made a goal.
Progress is not a very easy thing to accomplish, is often divisive, but is a lot better than its opposite.
I can agree that 'extending equal societal acceptance to as many people as possible' is a good thing, but to broadly say 'progress' leads you down a dangerous hole of shifting terminology.
The road to hell is paved in good intentions
That's very true
However, it doesn't mean we shouldn't have a road at all
We should just watch where we're going
I would disagree actually